Clear Institute vs. Schroth Method

[green m&m]

Regarding the figure skater, I doubt I'm the only one thinking this, and I'm sure some heat will come my way but still needs to be said.

The youtube testimonial is posted by a profile that seems to indicate was created by someone with some sort of ties from SpineCor brace. I'm skeptical of any review-like statements, negative/positive, that comes from the source that generates the product/services. That's regardless of what/who/ect.

Further, the degrees she says in her initial post and the video aren't the same. If someone knew enough to post the exact degree in a post... why give a vague number in a video?

Lastly, just like if a fit-healthy looking guy in a TV commercial says 'my buddy used to not work but after the little blue pill, he's up and happy! yeah!!! Now the Mrs is happy too. *walks/runs off into sunshine*' Did he really take it and is giving a true, personal experienced based 'testimonial'?

Just a thought.

[mariaf]

Regarding the figure skater, I doubt I'm the only one thinking this, and I'm sure some heat will come my way but still needs to be said.

The youtube testimonial is posted by a profile that seems to indicate was created by someone with some sort of ties from SpineCor brace.

Who WOULDN'T be skeptical under those circumstances???

Why does it seem that these claims are ALWAYS made by someone with "ties" to Spinecor - and that there is very little, if any, claims about Spinecor's effectiveness by those NOT connected with the brace?

I'm just asking........

[concerned dad]

Maria and Green MM, You are missing the point.

I apologize if I didnt qualify my statement about the youtube testamonial being posted by the NYC Chiropractors. Folks like myself who looked into the SpineCor realize this and I wrongly assumed it was common knowledge.

Yes, the post was made by the guys in NY. But, the testamonial is from the very same young woman who was not welcomed to this site.

I am no fan of the SpineCor brace and I dont think it can be beneficial to a 20 year old woman (other than for pain perhaps) but my point is that she is REAL. It is not the NY Doctors impersonating someone.

[christine2]

My daughter has had very good results with Spinecor. It is very easy to wear (back bends for cheerleading are a small challenge however she keeps practicing) Our goal with the brace is to keep her curve in the very low, if not non existant range until her growth spurt. If she goes from 1* to 20* in brace in 2-3 yrs we are golden. The chances of that happening are good. The chances of it staying at 1* are small. Heck I would take either. Worst case scenerio we are buying time until something better comes along. I have absolutely no connection with Spinecor other than that my daughter is a patient

I would also like to state that I see a chiropractor every couple months for pain management. I have congenital fused vertibrae in my neck- no scoliosis- I have been off pain meds and anti inflammatorys for 15 yrs because of him.

[green m&m]

Maria and Green MM, You are missing the point.Yes, the post was made by the guys in NY. But, the testamonial is from the very same young woman who was not welcomed to this site.

I am no fan of the SpineCor brace and I dont think it can be beneficial to a 20 year old woman (other than for pain perhaps) but my point is that she is REAL. It is not the NY Doctors impersonating someone.

No, I'm not missing the point. What I was trying to say, without actually stating it is that we have no way of knowing wether she's really who she says she is, or someone reading a script.

Yes I realize she may be real and I'm just shoving my whole leg in my mouth, but the testimonial could also be an elaborate accessory to validate a non-existent success story.

[concerned dad]

but the testimonial could also be an elaborate accessory to validate a non-existent success story.

Why go through all that trouble when all you have to do is exaggerate a few cobb measurements.

Maybe you're not green MM but rather a blue MM who wants to sound environmentally friendly We'll never know for sure but have to take some things on faith.

I think she is a real person (and I'm betting green is your color).

[green m&m]

Nah, I was blue until I went frolicking with yellow.

Actually, green m&m because green's the only girl.

[mariaf]

Hi CD,

I think we do get your point. She could be real (or as green m&m said, she could be reading a script).

The sad thing is that there seems to be so much "advertising" for Spinecor - and so many claims made, only by folks who ARE connected to the company, that it's hard NOT to be skeptical, especially when there is a lot of money involved.

There is also the whole issue (which I do NOT wish to debate with anyone again) of the in-brace only x-rays, which the rest of the orthopedic world (outside of Spinecor prescribers) disagrees with.

If you search some old posts, Dr. Deutchmann was also the one who required money for "vestibular testing" when he prescribed the Spinecor brace. Maybe it's the NY cynic in me, but a lot of the things connected with Spinecor just don't sit right with me.

Maybe I'm preaching to the choir here, because I believe you, too, did your homework with respect to this

[christine2]

Dr Rivard and Colliard do not do vestibular testing or any exersizes. They want the child to do normal activitys in the brace to strenghthen the muscles naturally.

[mamamax]

The ice skater and I share the same practice. And she is nationally ranked - i'm surprised others could not find this information. She's real, i'm real, Emsmom is real and so is MissEmmyF ... the list goes on. Some people have remarkable success with Spinecor - some don't. Did notice seven (7) Spinecor presentations at SOSORT in France this year. One from Rivard and Collard actually stating that this bracing design absolutely does in fact change the natural history of adolescent scoliosis (idiopathic). For adults, a rather grand experiment that has only been conducted since 2005, so at this point things only appear "promising". As i am also using Schroth exercises (along with Spinecor) - and given the promising treatment so far .. i feel confident in this selection for myself. There are many cases of scoliosis that respond to these things - Schroth, SEAS, Spinecor. So what's the big deal? I don't think that just because someone has success with a non-surgical method, or is excited to begin one, that they should be treated with suspicion. The NYC practice bty, does not require vestibular testing/rehabilitation, but it is offered (and if one takes a good hard look at that - there may in fact be much merit in it).

[txmarinemom]

Hi CD,

I think we do get your point. She could be real (or as green m&m said, she could be reading a script).

The sad thing is that there seems to be so much "advertising" for Spinecor - and so many claims made, only by folks who ARE connected to the company, that it's hard NOT to be skeptical, especially when there is a lot of money involved.

Yes ... there are a LOT of ties to SpineCor that are hidden - including the ones revealed to Mgmt here recently. Why were those such a secret? I'm still asking myself that.

While I was somewhat open to SpineCor under some circumstances, the fact there was a vested interest undermined my overall view. There's a reason no SRS surgeon I know of will rx SpineCor for adolescents and adults ... (my doc, at Shriners Houston, and his colleagues) will not. They don't believe it works in those scenarios. They think even using them for pain mgmt is useless, but they're willing to see what happens: A REAL Dr. would never rx them for curve correction as the ice queen claimed.

If I'm running people off with what I believe to be the truth, CD (which has a LOT more years on your version of "wishing to be the truth"), complain and get me out of your hair. I stated a month ago I wanted off this forum and my requests were denied.

Do you want me off or not? Do you want me to not defy your statements now, or be a resource if and when your daughter needs surgery? The latter was a statement by you ...

Go for it.

[Pooka1]

[COLOR="Navy"]The ice skater and I share the same practice. And she is nationally ranked - i'm surprised others could not find this information.

Seems she claims to also be internationally ranked...

"See I am internationally and nationally ranked and I have a lot to look forward to with my skating."

Someone checked the ranking around the time of the post (last September) and couldn't find a Danielle of the relevant age. I checked last night and found a Danielle of the exact correct age but the picture doesn't match to the woman on the video.

It doesn't matter if the particulars are off except in the sense that the person either is or is not comfortable with shading the truth and what that might mean for her comments about Spinecor. Recall that juries are allowed to disregard the ENTIRE testimony of witnesses who are shown to have committed perjury, not just the lie. There is a reason for that.

I think she's real because it's hard to fake sincere cluelessness to that extent.

[mariaf]

The NYC practice bty, does not require vestibular testing/rehabilitation, but it is offered (and if one takes a good hard look at that - there may in fact be much merit in it).

I know of at least one parent who was told by Dr. Deutchmann that her daughter should get the vestibular testing in conjunction with the Spinecor brace. She was at the very least "encouraged" to do so - to say that the testing is simply "offered" is not accurate. When you entrust your child's care to someone, and they suggest or recommend something that they feel will be helpful, chances are that a lot of parents will follow the recommendations of that person with regard to ALL aspects of treatment.

As for the merit of vestibular testing as it relates to scoliosis, you suggest we "take a long, hard look" - what exactly does that MEAN? If there is proof of the merit of vestibular testing as it relates to scoliosis, can you please point us to it?

[concerned dad]

Pam,
You misunderstand me. I don’t want you off the forum. You are a valuable contributor and I, and many others, have benefited by your participation.

But I’ve been here long enough to know that you are tough. You don’t hesitate to dish out criticism when you feel it is warranted. I don’t have a problem with that. Especially if you are willing to listen to an opposing view like I am offering here.

I am not defending SpineCor or the NYC Chiropractors. They are fair game for discussion, criticism (and praise). I am defending Danielle.

I am a short-timer on this forum. I am here on my little girls behalf to try to understand the condition and make rational, educated decisions. As my daughter grows into adulthood, she will be responsible for her own decisions about scoliosis. I don’t have to live with this the rest of my life in the way that you and she must. You belong here much more than myself. As does Danielle.

I think you, and others, had a knee-jerk reaction to the words “SpineCor” and “Chiropractors” and did not make her feel welcome on this forum.

The issue of her skating standing is totally irrelevant. She didn’t swear an oath to be accurate. I am ashamed to admit (because it shouldn’t make a difference) that last night I spent some time googling the issue. I believe I found who she is and if I am correct she performed remarkably well in the mid 2000’s; winning or placing in several national and international competitions. The only photo I found was 5 years old so I can’t be 100% sure. In any event, suppose she more accurately should have said “I WAS nationally ranked” rather than “I AM nationally ranked”. Folks jumped all over this statement as though she was a fraud. Does it really matter? She has scoliosis, just like you do, just like my daughter and just like countless others here.

It is too late for Danielle. I really doubt she will ever be back. But the lesson to be learned is that not all people who see a chiropractor and/or use the SpineCor and/or are misinformed about the condition are frauds. It is better to welcome 10 imposters to this forum than to loose one true person who needs the support of, and can share their experiences with, the folks on this forum.

(Some folks may see the similarity of that statement to something in the book of Genesis; Sharon, you can refer to the Simpsons episode where the Springfield Police Chief says "I'd rather let a thousand guilty men go free than chase after them.")

[Pooka1]

(Some folks may see the similarity of that statement to something in the book of Genesis; Sharon, you can refer to the Simpsons episode where the Springfield Police Chief says "I'd rather let a thousand guilty men go free than chase after them.")

I'd just like to know how many chiros can pass through the eye of a needle.