Attacking the President & CEO

[mamamax]

Hello to all, I am writing to add my voice to the numbers of members who no longer post/ no longer read this forum on a daily basis, like I used to. I was so excited when I found this forum, to finally meet other people who suffer from pain and disabilty, whose lives have spiraled inward to a rest and work cycle that severly limited social interaction/ or any serious activities.

I have become somewhat of a recluse, because of the pain.

But I totally agree with Writer, there have been SO MANY posts that are rude, that lack any charity or kindness, posts that attack the person- not the idea; I cringe when I read these posts and I shrink back into my lurker status. Why, you ask? why don't I just reply? #1- the main reason: I don't have the time or the energy. I don't even have time or energy to fix my hair - let alone engage in a heated and convoluted online argument with hostile posters!!!

When I am in such pain I can no longer walk or stand, I try to rest and grab the laptop... only to find beligerence and personal criticisms on this forum.

I also have formed the opinion that Linda Racine plays favorites- that certain members jump at any opportunity to belittle certain opinions/ beliefs about scoliosis. And as for the banning of religion...?!!?! I am incredulous! can I no longer say "I will pray for you" when someone is having surgery, or having a rough recovery? Let's be adults! If you don't want to read my posts, then skip it. I post seldom enough, no hardship for missing any! But why the ban ?

<sigh> Is it so difficult to be kind? we are all in pain, we are all deformed, and looking for answers. Can't we support one another instead of tearing each other down? praying for peace, jamie

Thank you for speaking up Scooter. God Bless you. The banning of faith which plays an important part in our lives is as you say - incredulous. That is a fact.

[Writer]

Missing the point

You can ignore my posts, or the posts of anyone else, by adding that individual to your ignore list.

http://www.scoliosis.org/forum/profi...?do=ignorelist

I'm afraid that this response completely misses the point. It's actually quite astonishing, this unwillingness to recognize the seriousness of the overall issue. I think "insensitive" is an accurate description.

I stand by my analyses above and am gratified to see them validated by people I don't know.

[Pooka1]

Let's be adults! If you don't want to read my posts, then skip it.

Though I have been saying the same thing, several people are on record as not wanting to do this.

Think.

Think.

Think.

For yourself.

[Qikdraw]

I'm afraid that this response completely misses the point. It's actually quite astonishing, this unwillingness to recognize the seriousness of the overall issue. I think "insensitive" is an accurate description.

I stand by my analyses above and am gratified to see them validated by people I don't know.

What I find most disturbing is the blatant hypocracy put out by some people who say they want an end to discord on the forums. You want calm on these forums? Stop posting threads that attack other posters, cause that is all this entire thread is, just a direct attack on posters you don't like, and all you're doing is trying to sow discord and get people behind you.

You want calm and peace on these boards? Stop posting crap like this.

THIS crap is why I don't come here as often, its not the ones Writer is complaining about, its Writer and those with him in attacking other posters, all the while claiming they are against such things.

[mamamax]

What I find most disturbing is the blatant hypocracy put out by some people who say they want an end to discord on the forums. You want calm on these forums? Stop posting threads that attack other posters, cause that is all this entire thread is, just a direct attack on posters you don't like, and all you're doing is trying to sow discord and get people behind you.

You want calm and peace on these boards? Stop posting crap like this.

THIS crap is why I don't come here as often, its not the ones Writer is complaining about, its Writer and those with him in attacking other posters, all the while claiming they are against such things.

QD ~ Firstly, Happy 4th of July!

Agree with you - there is much to be disturbed about. And like you ... i would much like to find peace in the non-surgical section. There is a problem however, in this section. Writer addresses it head on. And others like Writer who have been long disturbed by the problem that exists - have lent their voices to acknowledge that a serious problem, does in fact, exist. Not a pretty sight i'll admit. But something has to be done about the problem and ignoring it, or clicking little triangles - will not make it go away.

The problem is this: There is enough continued and open disrespect for people in the non-surgical section that those who would like to peacefully participate on this board - find that they must openly confront it in the hopes of effecting change. Ignoring it like i said, will not make it go away. This problem does not exist on the surgical boards - and it should not exist here. The only alternative the non-surgical folks have is - to not participate in a board created for them - with the purpose of being just as helpful to them, as the surgical section is to others.

This thread was started because of the open disrespect for Joseph O'Brien. Many disrespectful things have been said about him, bringing many things about him into question - his faith, his character, his abilities, and his direction. Given who and what Joseph O'Brien really is - this has just been too much for many of us to bear, and Writer has spoken up about it .. many others have voiced their agreement. The disrespect shown to Joe - is a mirror of what others have experienced in trying to peacefully participate on the non-surgical board. And QD, I'll just bet that if these accusations against Joe had happened over on the surgical board - that you would have been one of the first to speak out against it.

It seems as though the non-surgical boards have become a form of entertainment for a select few who believe it is a place to debate rather than share (compare this board to the surgical section and see if this does not ring true). Does debate belong in the non surgical section? I think not - no more that it belongs over in the surgical section. Perhaps debate deserves its own little section - but certainly not among those seeking or engaging in current treatment - surgical or non surgical. And the debate that occurs here in the non-surgical board, is more tool to hijack and confuse a thread than it is sincere desire to help others engaged in non surgical treatment. If what goes on here - went on in the surgical section ... how many would sit passively by and endure it without comment? Few i suspect.

Fair and equitable treatment is all that is being asked for. That should not be too much to expect. Up-thread, there is a post from Jamie (Scooter950) that has been weighing heavy on my mind. How many more are there that no longer participate on the non-surgical board because it quite simply is too difficult amid the disrespect .. making the attempt truly counterproductive to any current non surgical treatment option one may be engaged in. Jamie, if you are reading this - i hope the most recent threads started by Betty14 will prove problem free, and that you will feel safe to contribute there.

A doctor i saw this week said to me (before even exchanging a greeting) ... Are you still abusing yourself by trying to participate at NSF?

Something needs to be done.

Have a Happy and Safe 4th of July weekend everyone!

[Pooka1]

Thank you for speaking up Scooter. God Bless you. The banning of faith which plays an important part in our lives is as you say - incredulous. That is a fact.

Linda will correct me if I'm wrong but I doubt she meant banning people saying prayers for folks or asking that others pray for their kid.

There is nothing wrong with that.

Faith is certainly important to a lot of people and this forum is too small as it is. I hope folks don't think what you wrote because I do think more would leave if they thought that.

I assume Linda meant banning everything else beyond saying prayers.

Faith, as opposed to evidence, is not relevant to a serious subject like scoliosis research or treatment. And I certainly hope comments about dead scientists who can't defend them self are banned.

[scooter950]

ignore??

You can ignore my posts, or the posts of anyone else, by adding that individual to your ignore list.

http://www.scoliosis.org/forum/profi...?do=ignorelist

Hi again, linda- why would I want to ignore the moderator? I think your posts would be exempt from this "ignore" list- shouldn't that be one of the rules? how can you moderate the discussion if I am able to ignore your posts? just wondering... no offense intended. Moderating is a difficult job, I couldn't do it. Jamie

[LindaRacine]

Hi again, linda- why would I want to ignore the moderator? I think your posts would be exempt from this "ignore" list- shouldn't that be one of the rules? how can you moderate the discussion if I am able to ignore your posts? just wondering... no offense intended. Moderating is a difficult job, I couldn't do it. Jamie

When I use my moderating powers (hey, I'm a super hero ;-), you'll see deleted posts with a comment regarding the reason for deletion. When I post as myself, I am not a moderator.

--Linda

[Qikdraw]

QD ~ Firstly, Happy 4th of July!

To you as well! And a belated Happy 1st of July! (Canada Day, I am Canadian after all, even if I am currently living in the US )

Agree with you - there is much to be disturbed about. And like you ... i would much like to find peace in the non-surgical section. There is a problem however, in this section. Writer addresses it head on. And others like Writer who have been long disturbed by the problem that exists - have lent their voices to acknowledge that a serious problem, does in fact, exist. Not a pretty sight i'll admit. But something has to be done about the problem and ignoring it, or clicking little triangles - will not make it go away.

There is a way to deal with it and that is to report it to Linda, and if you do not feel she is doing the job then PM Joe and ask him to step in. Starting up a thread to directly attack those Writer disagrees with only makes the problem worse, not better. Lines are now drawn in teh sand and the bickering is getting worse, not better.

The problem is this: There is enough continued and open disrespect for people in the non-surgical section that those who would like to peacefully participate on this board - find that they must openly confront it in the hopes of effecting change. Ignoring it like i said, will not make it go away. This problem does not exist on the surgical boards - and it should not exist here. The only alternative the non-surgical folks have is - to not participate in a board created for them - with the purpose of being just as helpful to them, as the surgical section is to others.

Who is doing the disrespect? Sharon for wanting proof of proceedure's validity, or Writer for calling people who dare ask such questions 'brownshirts' (Nazis)? Look at it from both sides equally.

This thread was started because of the open disrespect for Joseph O'Brien. Many disrespectful things have been said about him, bringing many things about him into question - his faith, his character, his abilities, and his direction. Given who and what Joseph O'Brien really is - this has just been too much for many of us to bear, and Writer has spoken up about it .. many others have voiced their agreement. The disrespect shown to Joe - is a mirror of what others have experienced in trying to peacefully participate on the non-surgical board. And QD, I'll just bet that if these accusations against Joe had happened over on the surgical board - that you would have been one of the first to speak out against it.

Joe is an adult, and if I am not mistaken he was answering those charges himself. He doesn't need others to speak for him. This thread was nothing more than [i]another[i] attemp by Writer to get rid of people he has disagreed with for years. All he is doing now is trying to get others to help him stage a revolt.
And no I would not speak out about something like that. At best I would have reported it to Linda, and then Joe if needed. Joe does not need my help to defend himself.
Plus, some peole are just not going to believe anything put to them, and its no sense starting more and more arguements with them about it. If Sharon and Pam want to believe whatever they want to about Joe, true or not, how does that effect me? It doesn't. I'll let Joe address those issues and I'll just go about my own business in encouraging other people in their struggles and asking questions as I feel the need to.

It seems as though the non-surgical boards have become a form of entertainment for a select few who believe it is a place to debate rather than share (compare this board to the surgical section and see if this does not ring true). Does debate belong in the non surgical section? I think not - no more that it belongs over in the surgical section. Perhaps debate deserves its own little section - but certainly not among those seeking or engaging in current treatment - surgical or non surgical. And the debate that occurs here in the non-surgical board, is more tool to hijack and confuse a thread than it is sincere desire to help others engaged in non surgical treatment. If what goes on here - went on in the surgical section ... how many would sit passively by and endure it without comment? Few i suspect.

If a surgeon, or people pushing surgery, came into the surgical section and said that surgery is needed for every scoliosis patient you can guarentee that there would be debate on that subject.
The problem on the alternative treatments is that there seems to be no long term studies done. That leaves a lot of questions about the validity of some of it. However I have yet to see anyone discourage trying it and if it helps then great. The only question has been about the long term effects and will it stand up to time?
Look at my preop xray in my sig lines and tell me if alternative treatments would have helped me. I had a chiropracter say he could have fixed me, and that I would not have needed surgery at all. Its that kind of stuff we have to watch out for as it is very dangerous, I am sure you can see that. Its the same thing with other forms of alternative treatments, some people have made wild claims and we do need to keep an eye on that so that people don't get mislead into false hopes. (in both surgery and alt treatments)

Fair and equitable treatment is all that is being asked for. That should not be too much to expect. Up-thread, there is a post from Jamie (Scooter950) that has been weighing heavy on my mind. How many more are there that no longer participate on the non-surgical board because it quite simply is too difficult amid the disrespect .. making the attempt truly counterproductive to any current non surgical treatment option one may be engaged in.

Fair and equitable treatment goes both ways, and those on Writers side need to show the same respect back. But as I have said earlier Writer has been guilty of personal attacks and that shows he has no respect either. Which is why there is the hypocracy in what he says he wants now. If you want fairness you don't start threads attacking other posters. If someone is disrespecful to you, stay respectful back, its that easy.
Remember just because someone disagrees with something doesn't mean its disrespect. If so I guess we are all guilty.

Something needs to be done.

I agree, but Linda and Joe are the ones to handle it.

Have a Happy and Safe 4th of July weekend everyone!

You too! I'm staying home with my dogs cause they get scared by fireworks. My mother-in-law is taking a grandson to a bbq then fireworks.

[Qikdraw]

When I use my moderating powers (hey, I'm a super hero ;-), you'll see deleted posts with a comment regarding the reason for deletion. When I post as myself, I am not a moderator.

--Linda

Linda,

I do not envy you your position here. I am an admin on one site and a mod on another site, neither have the arguements we have here.
The only problem we have on one site is bots posting porn. Its good we don't have that problem here.

[Pooka1]

The only problem we have on one site is bots posting porn. Its good we don't have that problem here.

That might eventually drive me away. I get scared just seeing the screen names that folks try to register here. I'm so glad none of them slip through the registration when there are kids on this forum.

[mamamax]

Happy 4th of July Everyone :-)

[Ballet Mom]

Happy 4th of July Everyone :-)

Happy Independence Day to you too, Mamamax

Lest we forget, we are the land of the free and the home of the brave.

Excerpts from the Declaration of Independence:

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.”

“And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honor.”

John Hancock, et al.
July 4, 1776

[LindaRacine]

Thanks for the support Brad. I've always known you were a stand up guy, but staying home with the scared dog proves it unequivocally. Happy 4th.

--Linda

[mamamax]

4th of July :-)

Happy Independence Day to you too, Mamamax

Lest we forget, we are the land of the free and the home of the brave.

Excerpts from the Declaration of Independence:

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.”

“And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honor.”

John Hancock, et al.
July 4, 1776

Thanks Ballet Mom! Some may enjoy this too:

Have you ever wondered what happened to the 56 men who signed the Declaration of Independence?

Five signers were captured by the British as traitors, and tortured before they died.

Twelve had their homes ransacked and burned. Two lost their sons serving in the Revolutionary Army; another had two sons captured.

Nine of the 56 fought and died from wounds or hardships of the Revolutionary War.

They signed and they pledged their lives, their fortunes, and their sacred honor.

What kind of men were they?

Twenty-four were lawyers and jurists. Eleven were merchants, nine were farmers and large plantation owners; men of means, well educated, but they signed the Declaration of Independence knowing full well that the penalty would be death if they were captured.

Carter Braxton of Virginia, a wealthy planter and trader, saw his ships swept from the seas by the British Navy. He sold his home and properties to pay his debts, and died in rags.

Thomas McKeam was so hounded by the British that he was forced to move his family almost constantly. He served in the Congress without pay, and his family was kept in hiding. His possessions were taken from him, and poverty was his reward.

Vandals or soldiers looted the properties of Dillery, Hall, Clymer, Walton, Gwinnett, Heyward, Ruttledge, and Middleton.

At the battle of Yorktown, Thomas Nelson, Jr., noted that the British General Cornwallis had taken over the Nelson home for his headquarters. He quietly urged General George Washington to open fire. The home was destroyed,
and Nelson died bankrupt.

Francis Lewis had his home and properties destroyed. The enemy jailed his wife, and she died within a few months.

John Hart was driven from his wife's bedside as she was dying. Their 13 children fled for their lives. His fields and his gristmill were laid to waste. For more than a year he lived in forests and caves, returning home to find his wife dead and his children vanished.

What price Freedom (anywhere) eh? I have not checked out the accuracy of all this - was sent to me by a reliable source .. maybe our history buffs can let us know.