Does anyone know anything about this?

[flerc]

Yes he could have but there isn't the thinnest shred of evidence he did. Where did you get the idea that chiro was invented in Tibet and the Inca Empire????

I know it because there is a method in my country derived from Tibetan Chiropractic. In others Inca Chiropractic is still used.

[Pooka1]

Excellent post, Burdle. These chiros exploit the scientific ignorance of the public in shameless ways.

The CLEAR institute is based on chiropractic- it is a few chiros who have decided to specialise in Scoliosis - probably because with an aging world population they saw a gap in the market from which to make money.

Scolismart is an offshoot from CLEAR - it appears that they fell out with CLEAR over the traction chair - yet they seemingly they still support their other methods.

They are all chiros- but chiropractic itself has changed over the years from those who believe all disease originates from spinal misalignment and those who just specialise in pain relief etc. CLEAR and SColismart belong to the latter - except now they are moving in Scolisos territory claiming that they can prevent progression and reduce curves.

@ Flerc- it is the Facebook sites that worry me the most. As soon as you get misinformed people with scoliosis posting about their marvellous results we have problems. I believe the people are genuine - just that they are no really knowledgeable about their own condition ( again a gap in the market). Scolismart get hold of them- set up a fancy exercise program and give them an Activity Suit ( piece of nonsense no better than a corset) and tell them how much their curve is reduced. We do not even know if the prople were in pain- they were just frightened witless about having a curve in the first place and are now being told it is reducing but only if they keep up the exercise program.

Scolismart and CLEAR cannot lose- if the curve fails to progress (as it might well have have anyway) they claim success. If the curve does progress they claim that the ercercises were done done properly. Job Done...

I mind most that they are now moving into adult territory- again because of the wide scope of scoliosis - taking adults with degenerative curves and claiming success. They simply don't understand any difference between degenerative adult scoliosis and Adult IDIOPATHIC scoliosis.

But the worst thing about them is that they are cosying up to some scoliosis surgeons who do VBT.

I think VBT is great - anything that helps without having to have full fusion has got to be BUT Scolismart pretend that for the cases that do not work that they are keeping the spine flexible to enable them to be candidates for VBT. This is palpable nonsense- if VBT needs a flexible spine then it will depend on age and ordinary exercise - not on Scolismart. But again it is a win for the chiros- they get the money.

I truly believe that we need a better way for the treatment of Scoliosis- I just wish it was coming from within the medical profession - led by physiotherapists maybe and not from chriropractic.

[Pooka1]

I know it because there is a method in my country derived from Tibetan Chiropractic. In others Inca Chiropractic is still used.

They may call it chiro but it isn't. The concepts Palmer used were not known in Tibet or the Incan Empire as far as I know.

I think you insult these cultures by claiming they did chiro.

[flerc]

I'm referring to the procedure, vertebral manipulation as I know. Tibetan is much soft, as I have heard and saw, Inca Chiropractic seems to be more similar. Surely they had not those concepts.. I don't know how ancient cultures developed what they developed. It seems you hate Chiropractic, it's because Clear? Petitbon and Traction chair really has nothing to do with what Palmer invented or reinvented.

[Pooka1]

It seems you hate Chiropractic,

I dislike alternative medicine pretending to be medicine.

Q: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
A: Medicine.

And I hate people taking advantage of people when they are desperate.

[flerc]

I dislike alternative medicine pretending to be medicine.

Q: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
A: Medicine.

But before being called Medicine it was called Alternative Medicine, so it has no sense.

And I hate people taking advantage of people when they are desperate.

Me too, but also people trying to vanish everything not recognized for the medical protocol.

[burdle]

It's the methods that chiro use that I hate.

The medical profession expects evidence - the fault with chiropractic is that they 'adopt' all the terminology that the medical profession use like peer- 'reviewed' and 'research' but manipulate it for their own purpose.

Vulnerable people are taken advantage of - for example Scolismart will say something is 'peer-reviewed' or will state 'studies show' when what they mean is one of their colleagues reviewed and their own studies, based on flawed data has come to the conclusion that they intended it to in the first place!

Often the public don't know there is a difference.


I would have more- respect for CLEAR and Scolismart if they did not shamefully hang on the coattails of a profession that they claim to know more than.


Try Googling www.treatscoliosis.com and see their 'research'

[flerc]

@ Flerc- it is the Facebook sites that worry me the most. As soon as you get misinformed people with scoliosis posting about their marvellous results we have problems. I believe the people are genuine - just that they are not really knowledgeable about their own condition ( again a gap in the market). Scolismart get hold of them- set up a fancy exercise program and give them an Activity Suit ( piece of nonsense no better than a corset) and tell them how much their curve is reduced. We do not even know if the prople were in pain- they were just frightened witless about having a curve in the first place and are now being told it is reducing but only if they keep up the exercise program.

Burdle, is these people showing the before-after x-rays?

[burdle]

Hi,

generally no - they just quote cobb angles. There is one case of a young girl where the xrays are shown but to really be valid you need to show the cobb angle drawn on each xray.

Take a look..

[flerc]

Then is difficult to believe of course. Some years ago I asked CLEAR for a real case and a mother of Panama send me an email, she didn't send x-rays pics, anyway her daughter was in a very different stage that I was looking for, so I was not too much interested. I always say the same 'if it's really good what you do, please put me in contact with a real successful case'.

[flerc]

It's the methods that chiro use that I hate.

The medical profession expects evidence - the fault with chiropractic is that they 'adopt' all the terminology that the medical profession use like peer- 'reviewed' and 'research' but manipulate it for their own purpose.

Vulnerable people are taken advantage of - for example Scolismart will say something is 'peer-reviewed' or will state 'studies show' when what they mean is one of their colleagues reviewed and their own studies, based on flawed data has come to the conclusion that they intended it to in the first place!

Often the public don't know there is a difference.


I would have more- respect for CLEAR and Scolismart if they did not shamefully hang on the coattails of a profession that they claim to know more than.


Try Googling www.treatscoliosis.com and see their 'research'

I think that CLEAR is something very much special, I would not judge Chiropractic for what they does. Certainly their own inventions don't convince me too much. If they are showing false cases as real cases, people must to know it!.

[burdle]

Agreed but how?

[burdle]

I think that CLEAR is something very much special, I would not judge Chiropractic for what they does. Certainly their own inventions don't convince me too much. If they are showing false cases as real cases, people must to know it!.

The chiropractic community must take responsibility for CLEAR and Scolismart- They are still Chiropractors.

[flerc]

Agreed but how?

I think that if someone in a Face group says about an improvement, we should to requires x-rays . Is different to forums where people are anonymus, they are sharing all their life with the rest of the world, is difficult they really may have any problem in showing it. If they refused then we should to say that we thinks is a fraud. And if proffessionals are who says that, we must to insists in knowing that cases. If they have thousands of cases, is not possible they cannot convince just only one to share their case in the group. It' s only an idea but at least people of the group sure should to realize that effectively it could be a fraud.

[flerc]

The chiropractic community must take responsibility for CLEAR and Scolismart- They are still Chiropractors.

I agree, they should to investigate how much true are behind Clear inventions. They incorporate other good scoliosis treatments as Spinecor and Schroth, that nothing have to do with Chiropractic, but their own inventions as traction chair and petibon system, are showed as a Chiropractor invention.. and of course if they are showing false cases as real, they should not allow them to do it any more.