Schroth discussed in the New York Times

[Pooka1]

My guess is that it's not the Schroth method in particular, but good old fashioned exercise. Once the exercise was stopped, well...

Schroth was invented by a lay person. It is still a fringe treatment in Germany and surgery goes on as usual. The grandson gave up trying to make it work.

Buyer beware.

[flerc]

At age 15, Rachel Mulvaney of Mount Sinai, N.Y., went to a clinic run by Beth Janssen, a Schroth therapist, in Stevens Point, Wis. Her 42-degree curve was progressing, and orthopedists had told her she needed surgery.

“Within the first three days there, I was out of pain for the first time in five years,” said Ms. Mulvaney, now 19. After eight months of Schroth exercises, her curve decreased to 30 degrees, and it has since dropped to 22 degrees — a reduction extremely rare in patients her age.

Four years without that curve! How many parents around the world would give everything to see this outcome on her sons! Rachel's parents may be sure that Schroth solved the scoliosis problem of her daughter .. absolute certainty sure we only may have about death.. surgical or non surgical attemps surely don't changes that fact.
I think that only a millenary discipline or a scientific one as Schroth may achieve something so fantastic. Is not the first case like this I know about Schroth, but is great to know that these evidences are now being known!.

[Pooka1]

It is interesting to ask why only one person in the SEAS study had a large reduction or why we don't hear about more large reductions like the girl in this article. If this was common with Schroth we would have heard about it by now. But we haven't.

It could be that only a few people have curves that can physically respond to PT.

Or it could be that only a few people are willing to do enough PT to get that large reduction.

Or it could be a combination. Who knows.

[mariaf]

It is interesting to ask why only one person in the SEAS study had a large reduction or why we don't hear about more large reductions like the girl in this article.

Agreed.

To be objective, I guess we have to ask ourselves if another method (bracing, VBS, or whatever method you choose) was shown to have great success in ONE patient, wouldn't we want to be very cautious and see how the majority responded? I think with any form of treatment, we want to see it work on a large number of patients. If this girl is simply the exception to the rule, for whatever reason, then by putting too much stock in her individual result, we risk - among other things - giving false hope to others.

[Pooka1]

If this girl is simply the exception to the rule, for whatever reason, then by putting too much stock in her individual result, we risk - among other things - giving false hope to others.

Yes I agree. This is my worry... hope dashed (and money wasted). It's important to understand where Schroth came from, the chance it had and missed to prove itself, and what claims it is actually making.

[flerc]

I think Schroth is probably the best PT method over the world, since I realized the scientific reasoning behind it when I have read the book. German is really a very much rational folk!.
Probably alone it cannot help all people to avoid surgery, who know?, but who may blame it?
With all the medical diagnosis possibilities existing today, a perfect non surgical treatment (according to the current knowledge and technology we have) is sure possible. A more complex and complete classification not only having into account degrees, age and Riser is needed!
In some cases something as Schroth may be enough, in others may be a brace, in others a combination of both, in others may not be enough and a brain treatment as what is being used in Spain may also be needed, in others a high bone remodeling treatment (as seems to be done with Fed machine) may also be needed.. ALL the current causes (that may be known) should to be determined and quantified in each case in order to know the best customized treatment in each case!.
Anyway is really a good start!

[rohrer01]

My niece didn't do a specific program of exercises tailored to her scoliosis. She went through the exact same boot camp drill that every other female soldier goes through. My sister said her scoliosis was no longer visible. Of course, there are no x-rays to "prove" how much reduction she got. She was skeletally mature when when she went in...got a huge reduction...quit the extensive exercising when she came out and curve progressed even worse than before. IF she had kept up the boot camp style exercises for life, she would probably have had success in keeping her curve at bay.

But people get sick, women get pregnant, etc.. These things don't allow them to keep up with the activities that reduced their curves. It's my opinion that her curve progressed even more because she had a bunch of kids. She has the typical right thoracic curve. It's not the having kids per se that caused it to get worse, but the fatigue that comes along with motherhood that disallows most women from having a military type exercise regimen.

I'm not convinced that "Schroth" is the answer. I believe that exercise helps. It has to be a lot of hard exercise that keeps one in really fit condition.

[flerc]

A more complex and complete classification not only having into account degrees, age and Riser is needed!

Certainly Schroth within PT parameters is extremely customized!
According the type of curve is the exercise indicated. The same exercise may be good in some cases and bad in others. I think is the only one method taking into account those differences. People doing any kind of exercise without all that knowledge, not only has very low odds of improving but also may be damaged. At least they should to read the Schroth book.

[Pooka1]

Schroth was invented by a lay person and it shows.

The inventor's grandson, a trained person, had about 10 years and at least 30,000 patients to try to show it works to avoid surgery. He failed to do so and now only works with bracing.

At some point absence of evidence is evidence of absence and I think we are at that point with Schroth. If it worked Weiss would have been able to show that. But he wasn't able to show that.

[rohrer01]

Weiss still refers people to Schroth clinics on his website. He studied to be a doctor not a PT. My interpretation of that is that he probably wanted to do more doctoring. His practice is as a Physical Medicine & Rehabilitation doctor. That's the primary expertise of the doctor that I see. Weiss focuses on rehabilitating children AFTER surgery now. Since he's done a few of those surgeries, he REALLY knows what's involved. Maybe he didn't have the stomach for that part, who knows. But he definitely keeps his practice centered around scoliosis.

I think that pain is an inhibitive factor that keeps some people with scoliosis from doing calisthenic type exercises. I just know that the untargeted exercises straightened my niece up. She had to push through a ton of pain in the military. She had stress fractures in both of her feet. She just tightened up her boots really tight and kept going. They would have dc'd her if they found out.

I do know that AFTER the military, her spine hurt her so badly that she called me in tears because she couldn't even get out of bed. She wanted me to find a specialist for her. She had never called me about her scoliosis before. The pain eventually settled down and now she has flare-ups and constant low-grade pain.

[mariaf]

IF she had kept up the boot camp style exercises for life, she would probably have had success in keeping her curve at bay.

But people get sick, women get pregnant, etc.. These things don't allow them to keep up with the activities that reduced their curves.

That's so true. I can't imagine anyone keeping up boot-camp style exercises (or any other regiment of that nature) forever. As you point out, life gets in the way.

Some days I can barely find time to shave my legs :-)

[flerc]

I was absolutely decided to "force" my daughter to do some exercises I think should to be perfect in order to achieve a good bone remodeling and others to strengthen the abdominal muscles, something I'm sure is necessary to hold the spine but after seeing these thread I began these days to reread the Schroth book.. Now I realize again that scoliosis is a different universe.. what sure is excelent in a normal body may be disastrous in an scoliotic body and how much absurd is for someone not having the Schroth's knowledge to think what may be good or not, what may be possible and what not. And I'm not sure to understand this book.. is extremly complex for me. I said that to a very much recognized physiatrist and she said me 'if it is difficult for me I don't want to imagine what may be for you'.
People having the chance to access Schroth method should not miss it. I wish to have that lucky.

[LindaRacine]

Fierc...

Drop it now, or we'll go back to deleting posts and closing threads. This argument has occurred far too many times and we're all bored with it.

--Linda

[flerc]

The argument is to not agree with what Pooka1 says? Ok.. you have the power here, I deleted it.

[carolmr]

"This may or may not have relevance.
My niece went into the Army. With the extensive calisthenic exercises they do in boot camp her curve all but disappeared. I'm surprised they took her with an obvious curve. But that's beside the point." - rorher

I find this fascinating. I've never heard of exercises helping scoliosis patients that weren't targeted specifically for scoliosis. I assume your niece was quite young when she entered the Army. Unfortunately, I doubt that calisthenics would work on older scoliosis patients.