Scoliosis Boot Camp

[tkare]

I am hoping someone here can help me. My sons scheduled surgery is rapidly approaching, and he has frantically begun to do his own research on alternative treatments. He came up with Scoliosis boot camp from the clear institute. It looks like a hoax to me but my son doesn't believe it and thinks that he was only told he needs surgery because the only opinions we sought out were from surgeons. His curvature is about sixty degrees. Can anyone shed some light on the clear institute and boot camp?

[Breezemom]

When i was doing my initial research i happened across this thread which has some info about CLEAR: http://www.scoliosis.org/forum/showt...found-you-guys!

Definitely looks pretty hokey! My 13 YO daughter has an upper curve of almost 60* and I totally understand the drive to find something that is non-surgical that works on curves once they get this big. The first surgeon we saw made it very clear to her that she was beyond bracing and beyond PT of any kind to help. She did do some of her own research which led her to the 3 part YouTube surgery posts. She said at first it disturbed her but then she was so intrigued with the whole thing she couldn't stop watching it! We are waiting for her surgery to be scheduled and because of her pain, in her opinion it couldn't happen soon enough.

I hope that your son is able to find some peace in knowing that a surgical solution is what is ultimately going to be the biggest benefit to him in the long run. I know that watching your kid go through this and try to process the whole awful mess from diagnosis to a surgical decision is one of the roughest things I've had to experience as a parent. It's hard not being able to tell them that there just really isn't any other good solution.

[Pooka1]

I am hoping someone here can help me. My sons scheduled surgery is rapidly approaching, and he has frantically begun to do his own research on alternative treatments. He came up with Scoliosis boot camp from the clear institute. It looks like a hoax to me but my son doesn't believe it and thinks that he was only told he needs surgery because the only opinions we sought out were from surgeons. His curvature is about sixty degrees. Can anyone shed some light on the clear institute and boot camp?

Clear not only has no evidence their "treatment" has avoided a single surgery but they claim they don't need evidence.

Clear has no evidence of stopping progression in smaller curves than what your son has (beyond what natural history would predict) so there is NO CHANCE they can do anything with a large curve other than take your money.

Chiros do NOT have relevant training to be working with scoliosis other than for pain and especially not in kids. They have the lowest GPA requirements for any of the allied medical schools. Chiros are therefore NOT alternatives to surgeons in any way shape or form.

Orthopedic surgeons are the only people qualified to treat scoliosis. They don't only do surgery... they prescribe conservative treatments such as PT and bracing all the time. The Clear chiros probably lied to him about surgeons only doing surgery. They also ignorantly comment on surgical outcomes to scare people. It's reprehensible.

The reason your surgeon suggested surgery is because that is the only known hope for a large thoracic curve in a teenage boy FULL STOP.

Have your son ask for evidence from the chiros that other boys his age with his curve magnitude were able to avoid surgery doing chiro. That should wake him up from this impossible dream.

Good luck.

[flerc]

I am hoping someone here can help me. My sons scheduled surgery is rapidly approaching, and he has frantically begun to do his own research on alternative treatments. He came up with Scoliosis boot camp from the clear institute. It looks like a hoax to me but my son doesn't believe it and thinks that he was only told he needs surgery because the only opinions we sought out were from surgeons. His curvature is about sixty degrees. Can anyone shed some light on the clear institute and boot camp?

Is remarkable being so young.. your son is really atypical.
I contacted Clear some years ago and as I ever do, I asked them about references and I recived a mail from a mother of Panama saying me her daughter was in full spurt and had a great reduction of her curve. Panama was far for us and and the Risser of my daughter was already high..
Certainly all what I read about Clear mehods and strategy is full of sense for me .. but of course you may be sure that nobody may give you guarantees.. in either direction.

[jrnyc]

ONE testimonial does not prove anything....
if there is no scientific proof, then why trust any organization
that makes claims...???
there has to be proof to back it up....
there are all kinds of scams that have nothing but testimonials...
most of those are not even real...

jess

[Pooka1]

Is remarkable being so young.. your son is really atypical.
I contacted Clear some years ago and as I ever do, I asked them about references and I recived a mail from a mother of Panama saying me her daughter was in full spurt and had a great reduction of her curve. Panama was far for us and and the Risser of my daughter was already high..
Certainly all what I read about Clear mehods and strategy is full of sense for me .. but of course you may be sure that nobody may give you guarantees.. in either direction.

How do you know they weren't lying?

[flerc]

They don't only do surgery... they prescribe conservative treatments such as PT and bracing all the time.

If and only if curve <= 50º.
Remember this is only a Forum.. take care about categoric claims. Nobody here is able to do them.

[Pooka1]

If and only if curve <= 50º.
Remember this is only a Forum.. take care about categoric claims. Nobody here is able to do them.

If they don't recommend conservative treatments past some point then it is because there is no evidence conservative treatments work past that point.

Fer, you know this or should know this.

T curves over about 50* with evidence of recent progression in a child are indicators for surgery as far as I know. Of course only a surgeon can say of the child is well enough.

[flerc]

How do you know they weren't lying?

I didn't say I was sure. I said I didn't travel to Panama, so is simple to deduce I never met her.
Certainly if was a lie, all in Clear are criminals and really are very adventurous. This mother gave me the personal telephone and from work. Some Clear Doctors if I not remeber bad gave conferences in Sosort.. is difficult for me to think that and it's a really serious accusation what you are doing.

[Pooka1]

I didn't say I was sure. I said I didn't travel to Panama, so is simple to deduce I never met her.
Certainly if was a lie, all in Clear are criminals and really are very adventurous. This mother gave me the personal telephone and from work. Some Clear Doctors if I not remeber bad gave conferences in Sosort.. is difficult for me to think that and it's a really serious accusation what you are doing.

The mother might think there was a great reduction or there might have been a reduction that was temporary. But the chiros must know if they ever reduced a large curve permanently. If they say they have and don't prove it then what do you think is going on?

[flerc]

If they don't recommend conservative treatments past some point then it is because there is no evidence conservative treatments work past that point.

Fer, you know this or should know this.

T curves over about 50* with evidence of recent progression in a child are indicators for surgery as far as I know. Of course only a surgeon can say of the child is well enough.

Of course I know what surgeons says. But other professionals probably think different, who knows?. If you are saying that is not any publication about a well known case with a very long follow up, probablly you may do that claim.
But claiming that never was just only one case and claiming that surgeons (or somebody else in the world) recommends ever the best for every case in the world is really a very big claim.
Remember, this is only a Forum, say all what you know, all what you think but take care about doing claims that you cannot prove.

[flerc]

The mother might think there was a great reduction or there might have been a reduction that was temporary. But the chiros must know if they ever reduced a large curve permanently. If they say they have and don't prove it then what do you think is going on?

Maybe, I don't know, it was not the exactly case I asked for and I didn't do a follow up. But certainly, few professionals contacted me with people treated for them..
Certainly what I think about Clear, Schroth and others is that they have some cases to show.. but only some.
If you know (as I suppose) how Marketing works, you will understand what I mean.

[flerc]

[COLOR="#0000CD"]
ONE testimonial does not prove anything....

Unlesst it would be true.

if there is no scientific proof, then why trust any organization
that makes claims...???
there has to be proof to back it up....

Is a very good question of course.. I replied to Sharon what I think about that

there are all kinds of scams that have nothing but testimonials...
most of those are not even real...

Yes but to put in contact with a false case.. of course I have not way to be sure..but is difficult to believe for me.

[jrnyc]

ONE case could prove that there could be an exception to every rule..
ONE case can be chance...
ONE case proves nothing...
One is equivalent to not any thing of any significance....besides chance.

sending you a PM tkare...best of luck with your son.

jess

[flerc]

ONE case could prove that there could be an exception to every rule..
ONE case can be chance...
ONE case proves nothing...
One is equivalent to not any thing of any significance....besides chance.

If you says that something is impossible, one case is a counterexample.
A counterexample prove that the claim was false.
And if it was false, how are you sure that could not be another case?
And if it might be another case, why are you sure that cannot be yours?