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Long term pain management - HELP

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  • #31
    sorry you are suffering, rohr! that sure sounds like it is on the continuum of detoxing...i hope the days pass quickly for you! hope you can sleep for some of it!

    jess

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    • #32
      I'm coming dangerously close to taking klonopin. I can't stand this. My mom says to "just take the klonopin and quit suffering". It's been two whole weeks since I have taken one so I'm wondering if I go back on an 'as needed' basis like I was before, where no dependency occurred, if it has been long enough. I don't want withdrawals from that stupid drug again.
      Be happy!
      We don't know what tomorrow brings,
      but we are alive today!

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      • #33
        BTW I'm sure it's fine with my doc.
        Be happy!
        We don't know what tomorrow brings,
        but we are alive today!

        Comment


        • #34
          The days are creeping along, second by second, minute by minute, it's aweful!!
          Be happy!
          We don't know what tomorrow brings,
          but we are alive today!

          Comment


          • #35
            so sorry, rohr, that it is so tough! can you sleep at all...? i think that's the best if it is possible for you...
            are you sure you are cutting back slowly enough?
            have you talked to the doctor about how tough this is going for you?
            i've been with all kinds of folks who have detoxed and gone into rehab...from heroin to pain meds to...all kinds of substances! it is hell...some situations worse than others!
            it seems so cruel when one has been on meds for doctor ordered care that is for the kind of back pain we have on forum...but it is hell for anyone, any reason!

            i hate to see anyone in pain...i would just suggest talking to the doctor again, if you havent already...

            jess

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            • #36
              Isn't there any other kind of pain med? Klonopin is so awful to get off of, and I had problems with Percocet, too. Bed sweats, hot/cold, panic attacks, etc.

              Actually, antidepressants eased my back pain (Celexa and Lexapro at different times), but mine was not severe. These take a while to back down from, too, but for me it was more a mental than physical thing.

              I take it Nsaids do nothing for you? What about exercise--is that an option? P/T did help me a lot.

              Commiserating--and wondering what I'm going to be taking post-surgery!

              Evelyn
              age 48
              80* thoracolumbar; 40* thoracic
              Reduced to ~16* thoracolumbar; ~0* thoracic
              Surgery 3/14/12 with Dr. Lenke in St. Louis, T4 to S1 with pelvic fixation
              Broken rods 12/1/19; scheduled for revision fusion L1-L3-4 with Dr. Lenke 2/4/2020
              Not "confused" anymore, but don't know how to change my username.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by rohrer01 View Post
                I'm coming dangerously close to taking klonopin. I can't stand this. My mom says to "just take the klonopin and quit suffering". It's been two whole weeks since I have taken one so I'm wondering if I go back on an 'as needed' basis like I was before, where no dependency occurred, if it has been long enough. I don't want withdrawals from that stupid drug again.
                I know, I know...Poor old thing (need huggie emoticon)
                Thing is, chances are IMO that you're still sensitive to Klonopin, It REALLY stays in the system, and they all change brain chemistry in different ways (though it can revert AFAIK given enough time without exposure).

                My efforts to get off Klonopin echoed by others I know, is that it leads to something called "akathisia" - a hideous creepy crawly feeling.

                As I wrote earlier the advice I got from on-line forums is that when detoxing from opiates, one big help is benzodiazapines. My neurologist (who initiated my withdrawal) said the same.

                You titrated down so great from the other stuff (I probably went way too fast) and you succeeded partly on that account. Maybe this is more of the same good sense and discipline.

                If you read online about Klonopin withdrawal you'll see how slow it's supposed to be done. Most withdraw from Klonopin going down in tiny increments (max 25 mg or half that), often staying on that dose for a week or more at a time before titrating further down - depending on how long they had been on and their response. It's such a deceptively powerful med that a tiny dosage can make a big difference. It even comes in pills of only .125 mg.

                Nb. now see I was NUTS in how I once approached it. What's more, I now realize my remaining dose is what's causing my tinnitus - ringing in the ear! . I'm resolving to discontinue it - very, very slowly (I've been taking it for 21 years!).

                On the chance that you're suffering from akathisia (sounds awfully like to me), perhaps it would safe-guard your other progress if you added a tiny bit back in. If you do, don't forget how long it takes to kick in! FYI it also comes in a fast acting tongue dissolving wafer (pricy) in these tiny doses.

                If not Klonopin, then maybe 5 mg Valium would help you wean from the patch and then Percocet. As you read online, Oxycontin and Fentanyl are NO joke. Withdrawing from TWO drug classes at the same time seems to me like really pushing it. Endangers your success unnecessarily - and, I believe, also your health.

                You're doing GREAT, but if you can't sleep and so on, it will make things so much harder for you...Maybe I'm over-identifying - I know what I needed and what is usual. Are you sure your doc knows you're trying to eliminate both classes at once? And is this is the same doc who didn't tell you there was a risk of seizures from coming off Klonopin? Nb it's true of all benzos, but especially K.

                It's a very powerful drug.

                Be well!
                Last edited by Back-out; 06-05-2010, 01:43 AM.
                Not all diagnosed (still having tests and consults) but so far:
                Ehler-Danlos (hyper-mobility) syndrome, 69 - somehow,
                main curve L Cobb 60, compensating T curve ~ 30
                Flat back, marked lumbar kyphosis (grade?) Spondilolisthesis - everyone gives this a different grade too. Cervical stenosis op'd 3-07, minimally invasive

                Comment


                • #38
                  hey rohr
                  did you call the doctor Friday? will he take a call from patient over wkend? i just think you should discuss all this with him before doing/changing anything...just to discuss possible outcomes, and alternatives...
                  i am praying that you have improvement over the wkend!

                  jess

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re Benzo withdrawal and seizures + FUSION -> ???

                    Per subject line...

                    It is occurring to me how extremely important it is to get off Klonopin before I have any spinal surgery!!! To think how people worry about sneezing...It scarcely bears contemplation, and yet we must!

                    Any pre-fusion folks on benzos take heed.

                    Also re points on the need for very slow withdrawal from benzos should one so decide...
                    Klonopin seems the worst offender, but it also occurs with Valium and Xanax.
                    And after all, all are anti-convulsants, however mild.
                    Not all diagnosed (still having tests and consults) but so far:
                    Ehler-Danlos (hyper-mobility) syndrome, 69 - somehow,
                    main curve L Cobb 60, compensating T curve ~ 30
                    Flat back, marked lumbar kyphosis (grade?) Spondilolisthesis - everyone gives this a different grade too. Cervical stenosis op'd 3-07, minimally invasive

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      I went to my mom's for the weekend. I made it without giving in. I took the klonopin bottle with me "just in case" and just having it there gave me courage NOT to take it. I think I do have that horrible crawly feeling. But today, for the first day I feel better, although it hit me again this evening. I have been breaking the percocet in half and am down to 3 per day. As I get better each day I stretch the percocet out longer and longer. It is working. Thanks for all the support! ((((HUGS)))) to all of you!!!
                      Be happy!
                      We don't know what tomorrow brings,
                      but we are alive today!

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        good for you, rohr!


                        jess

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                        • #42
                          What a relief! I've been thinking of you often. You did the right thing - including going to your mom's with bottle. How great she is able to be a mom to YOU - nothing more needed with something like this. To withdraw with YOUR dependents around you would be terrible for you and them. It couldn't be done without damage.

                          Good too that you had the K. bottle with you. Yes, it can give you strength. That way you can be aware that you are making a conscious choice every moment. Makes it seem more manageable; meanwhile, knowing relief is avaible, wards off panic.

                          This is especially important with the very real seizure issue always hovering. I think such worries themselves can lower the seizure thesh-hold.

                          Reminds me of a good reason to get off Klonopin (until - unless you get to the point where these meds are useful on an occasional basis. Not to merely "Feel normal", as you said early on).

                          I had a family reunion completely ruined by forgetting my Klonopin. It was pretty much the only prescription med I was taking then except for thyroid - haha - and yet SO important, for sleep and to avoid withdawal and seizures). It's NOT easy to scrape up an MD to prescribe it to you out of town on the spur of the moment. Ended up having to call an old HS classmate I thought had married a NYC shrink . Humiliating, and much of the long weekend went to tracking it down, inconveniecing everyone. Younger son a lively toddler at the time, had to be "sat". etc.

                          Klonopin is a medicine that must NEVER be forgotten on an out of town trip. Too many of them are, for that matter. That's one thing I most hate about them. I keep thinking - what if? (...What if, there were an external emergency which made meds unavailable, etc. ) Seems silly, as all prescription meds are in the vital category in some way but there it is.

                          Even thyroid! Without it, I'd become an imbecile - used to describe such patients. I need a high dose. When it was discovered, it rescued many otherwise normal people from asylums where they'd been languishing, thought to be hopeless mental defectives! Better to depend on nothing, if possible.
                          Last edited by Back-out; 06-07-2010, 12:15 PM.
                          Not all diagnosed (still having tests and consults) but so far:
                          Ehler-Danlos (hyper-mobility) syndrome, 69 - somehow,
                          main curve L Cobb 60, compensating T curve ~ 30
                          Flat back, marked lumbar kyphosis (grade?) Spondilolisthesis - everyone gives this a different grade too. Cervical stenosis op'd 3-07, minimally invasive

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            * Note to whom it may concern. NYState law has since changed so that one can get an out of town doc to prescribe even the most controlled substances for up to five (approx) days by calling/Faxing - to be followed up with written script.

                            That allows dependent out of of town visitors from going through what I went through then, with a class IV (?) narcotic. This law is even good for up to class II! (oxycontin, etc.) and might be true in other areas, too. This can be life-saving info tho best, of course, is never forget your meds!
                            Not all diagnosed (still having tests and consults) but so far:
                            Ehler-Danlos (hyper-mobility) syndrome, 69 - somehow,
                            main curve L Cobb 60, compensating T curve ~ 30
                            Flat back, marked lumbar kyphosis (grade?) Spondilolisthesis - everyone gives this a different grade too. Cervical stenosis op'd 3-07, minimally invasive

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              I went to the doctor today at Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation. He works closely with my pain doc. He recommended facet joint injections in my neck when I have my next flare-up. He can also do trigger point injections to help with the pain so I don't have to be put on so many narcotics. He also said I was doing really well with my withdrawal, even though I was sweating profusely, and told me to keep going with weaning down. I told him that I stepped down a little faster than I was supposed to and he asked me if I had needed klonodine (sp?) for it. I said no, so that was a good thing. He said they really try to avoid that if possible. So I'm doing really well. I still have pain and I always will. I'm just trying to find better ways to manage it than narcotics. He recommended swimming therapy, which I totally agree with as I have somewhat successfully done it before, but not until I'm feeling better from the withdrawals. I just wanted to say 'Thank You' to all of you again who have been supporting me through this difficult time.
                              Be happy!
                              We don't know what tomorrow brings,
                              but we are alive today!

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                hey rohr
                                so glad for you that they discussed pain injections...i get them often...some work, some dont, in my case anyway...and in many other patients i've seen who have same thing...to me, in my opinion,it is important not to give up if the first one doesnt work...sometimes the 2nd or 3rd is the charm

                                am happy for you that you have stuck it out...hope you are proud of you!

                                jess

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