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Clear - 63* -> 15* in a month?

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  • #31
    Napoleon Dynamite

    Hi TiEd,

    I LOVE Napoleon Dynamite, it's another of my favs along with Austin Powers, Better Off Dead, and The Legend of Ron Burgundy.

    Thanks for the comic relief, as usual, it is very welcomed!
    Gayle, age 50
    Oct 2010 fusion T8-sacrum w/ pelvic fixation
    Feb 2012 lumbar revision for broken rods @ L2-3-4
    Sept 2015 major lumbar A/P revision for broken rods @ L5-S1


    mom of Leah, 15 y/o, Diagnosed '08 with 26* T JIS (age 6)
    2010 VBS Dr Luhmann Shriners St Louis
    2017 curves stable/skeletely mature

    also mom of Torrey, 12 y/o son, 16* T, stable

    Comment


    • #32
      2 other videos

      In the past few months I have seen two other videos of this same girl.

      She posted one, on her own, just showing how the scoliosis made her walk. And another one was footage of her doing therapy, in the clinic, with the majority of the video being of another CP boy receiving therapy.

      I think TITANIUMED hit the nail on the head!

      "Why do her iliac crest heights in the after x-ray look so good?"

      If you look at her xray...where the sacrum goes..so goeth the pelvic girdle ...so goeth the appendages...that xray 100% fits with how she was walking...her sacrum is extremely tipped which would create a nasty gait.
      It would be extremely hard to maintain a "FAKE" curve while jumping.

      Is it possible the sacrum drove her curve??????

      Once they were able to correct the positioning of the sacrum, the rest of the curve followed????

      questions questions questions????

      Comment


      • #33
        A neuro diagnosis

        She commented on her video and also responded to Linda.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EXx-...layer_embedded

        What is reprehensible is that they don't say in the video that this case is UNLIKE 99.999999999999% of the cases out there. How common is that curve type? How common is it to reduce a 63* curve to 15* in a month? Clear has been at this for a while and they have exactly one case.

        Proof that they know this is not just atypical but possibly singular is that they don't plaster the case all over their web site. Rather they show on their page only minuscule reductions of curves due to correcting posture, building asymmetric musculature to compensate, or just standing differently.

        It is reprehensible.
        Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

        No island of sanity.

        Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
        Answer: Medicine


        "We are all African."

        Comment


        • #34
          I'd be OK with publicizing a rare event of reducing a curve - the SEAS people did the same thing. I'm much more troubled about this not being representative of scoliosis cases - i.e., that this is a type of scoliosis that is extremely rare, and that has been seen to spontaneously "cure" with several methods.
          Last edited by hdugger; 01-04-2010, 10:17 AM.

          Comment


          • #35
            The interesting thing is - if this young woman indeed has Transient Structural/Hysterical Scoliosis, such a condition is virtually indistinguishable from any other case of IS - as we see up thread with Dr. Hu's patient whose structural curves did not straighten with bending xrays, yet straightened once the patient was anesthetized.

            What I find worrisome is - the fact that there is no screening technique for this condition, which left untreated transforms into structural deformity - when such could have been avoided with proper diagnoses (which is admittedly difficult). How many such cases are there out there? We simply do not know.

            Comment


            • #36
              I believe the "whole body C curve" is extremely rare. In both this case and the Hu case, that was the type of curve.

              Comment


              • #37
                I would agree that the whole body C curve is rare. The way they responded, may not be so rare - among the Transient Structural/Hysterical Scoliosis classification. According to what little literature there is on that. Typically such curves (the transient structural/hysterical) according to the available documentation, present as a single thoracic curve - but there have been cases of thoracic/lumbar. And there have been both postural and structural presentations. I'm not saying both patients fall into this classification - but it could be that they do. There has been little follow up on this specific classification - probably because of the difficulty in diagnosing it?

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by mamamax View Post
                  - probably because of the difficulty in diagnosing it?
                  - probably because of the exquisite rarity of it.
                  Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

                  No island of sanity.

                  Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
                  Answer: Medicine


                  "We are all African."

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Pooka1 View Post
                    - probably because of the exquisite rarity of it.
                    exquisitely rare & exquisitely un-evaluated. I wonder what further evaluation the two discussed in this thread might receive.
                    Last edited by mamamax; 01-05-2010, 04:59 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Mamamax, I notice your buddy on the other forum is attributing the reduction to hard work. This means the following:

                      1. he doesn't understand that this is not AIS but a very rare type of neurological scoliosis,

                      2. he is saying, but for effort, everyone can reduce their curve this much, and,

                      3. he is implying that she did some massive amount of work... in one month.

                      I suggest he has NEVER had a patient reduce a 63* curve to 15* in a month and therefore he shouldn't ignorantly attribute the result to effort to follow Clear's protocol.

                      And people wonder why chiros have a bad reputation...
                      Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

                      No island of sanity.

                      Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
                      Answer: Medicine


                      "We are all African."

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Pooka1 View Post
                        Mamamax, I notice your buddy on the other forum is attributing the reduction to hard work. This means the following:

                        1. he doesn't understand that this is not AIS but a very rare type of neurological scoliosis,

                        2. he is saying, but for effort, everyone can reduce their curve this much, and,

                        3. he is implying that she did some massive amount of work... in one month.

                        I suggest he has NEVER had a patient reduce a 63* curve to 15* in a month and therefore he shouldn't ignorantly attribute the result to effort to follow Clear's protocol.

                        And people wonder why chiros have a bad reputation...
                        You're my "buddy" too Sharon - and up thread you attributed the young woman's improvement to stepping off the ledge and becoming less hysterical.

                        It would be nice to hear from the treating chiropractor.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by mamamax View Post
                          You're my "buddy" too Sharon - and up thread you attributed the young woman's improvement to stepping off the ledge and becoming less hysterical.

                          It would be nice to hear from the treating chiropractor.
                          I was kidding! Your other buddy appears to be serious.

                          If the treating chiro was prepared to admit he has never had another patient react that way to treatment and that all other patients had minuscule reductions that required far more than one month's effort, he would have done so on the video. Just my opinion.
                          Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

                          No island of sanity.

                          Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
                          Answer: Medicine


                          "We are all African."

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Pooka1 View Post
                            I was kidding!
                            Duly noted :-)

                            I think at the end of the day - that both the chiropractor, and the surgeon - have come across two very unusual cases. If either are actually cases of hysterical scoliosis, maybe it really isn't a laughing matter. Because, while phychosomatic in origin, such cases are no less real and "can" transform into spinal deformity. Further evaluation is needed. Regardless of origin, or treatment - I'm happy for the current outcome of the young woman in the video. Is she representative of all cases - certainly not. I wonder what Dr. Hu decided to do?

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by mamamax View Post

                              Because, while phychosomatic in origin,
                              No the kid on the video has a neuro diagnosis per her comment.

                              Now maybe most/all postural/hysterical scoliosis cases are in fact neuro cases. That certainly seems likely.
                              Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

                              No island of sanity.

                              Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
                              Answer: Medicine


                              "We are all African."

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Pooka1 View Post
                                No the kid on the video has a neuro diagnosis per her comment.

                                Now maybe most/all postural/hysterical scoliosis cases are in fact neuro cases. That certainly seems likely.
                                I thought she said she was being tested but that so far, no one had found anything?

                                An interesting theory yours, I've thought of that also - but how would it explain the structural presentation?

                                Comment

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