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Thread: Attacking the President & CEO

  1. #1
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    Attacking the President & CEO

    posts by pooka1:

    "He seems to be a man of faith, not evidence. … Faith in conservative treatments as against evidence for non-fusion (and possibly fusion) surgery. … I suggest that is no way to approach a serious medical issue (if that is indeed his approach)." Post #241

    "I was right. He's a man of faith, not evidence. … He's a man of faith AS AGAINST evidence. … Science is a way of knowing. Faith is a way of pretending to know." Post #250

    "What isn't ridiculous to suggest is that what gets linked to is simply where O'Brien's hopes and interests lie, as opposed to where the evidence leads. His site, his prerogative I suppose but that is not really being true to what facts are or are not out there." Post #256
    ++++++++++++++++++++++

    In the thread "Setting the Record Straight", which NSF President and CEO Joe O’Brien started as a response to accusations against him on this board, the President outlined the purposes of this forum.

    Item 10: "this Forum is intended to be a community center to give all patients and families an opportunity to give and receive vital information and support."

    and -- "we need open communication for all in an environment that shows courtesy and respect for, and by, everyone."

    Item 11: "Anyone unwilling or unable to abide by the spirit of item #10 is kindly asked to leave the Forum and find another venue to satisfy your needs."

    Bizarrely, that very thread has been hijacked and has degenerated into a vehicle for yet more accusations against Joe. Most recently in the form of pooka's "Faith versus evidence" campaign, an insult to the intellect and character of the President.

    I invite readers unfamiliar with Joe O’Brien’s deep and broad background in all kinds of scoliosis treatment, and his personal familiarity with the top practitioners worldwide, surgical and conservative, to read post #1 in the thread "Setting the Record Straight." He almost certainly knows more about more kinds of scoliosis treatment than *anybody* on this board.

    The proposition that he is promoting or discouraging any kind of treatment out of ignorance or blind faith is preposterous.

    Q: Why doesn't he chime in and defend himself? Answer: I'm sure that the organization’s president has more important demands on his time than to constantly comment on petty accusations and get involved in squabbles of the nature that have become all-too-common here. I would expect a moderator to do the defense for him and clamp down on the offenders.

    Linda, I request -- again -- that you control the very few people who are consistently out of control, disrupting discussions and alienating many participants with sarcastic or wild remarks, taking over threads, including now the President’s thread, and casting aspersions upon the President himself.

    The NSF Forum deteriorated noticeably after the appearance of tx and pooka around the beginning of 2008. You appear mostly to side with them, and never attempt to tone them down, in my observation. No thread in the Non-Surgical area is safe from their abrasive pontifications – yet they are not even interested in non-surgical treatments except insistently to disparage them. Now pooka is essentially attacking the President, as if she understands better than he how to manage the NSF.

    Only the moderator can maintain the environment that Joe has defined. The rest of us are hostages. Please enforce the principles that Joe defined above. Thank you.

  2. #2
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    in agreement

    I agree with Writer.

    A few prolific people use this board as nothing more than a vehicle to argue and discourage.

  3. #3
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    In Agreement

    June 2009 was the second Annual National Scoliosis Awareness campaign. Here the National Scoliosis Foundation and the Scoliosis Research Society combine efforts and resources toward educational materials for both patients and professionals. Through the efforts of Joe and others like him, this year US Representative Allyson Schwartz from Pennsylvania signs the 2009 Proclamation recognizing the observance of this awareness campaign:

    http://sites.google.com/site/wwwscol...ts-of-interest

    2009 Points of emphasis in this campaign: http://sites.google.com/site/wwwscol...ts-of-interest

    Info about this campaign: http://sites.google.com/site/wwwscol...paign-overview

    I imagine this was a busy month for Joe - once again sacrificing much time and energy towards helping those with scoliosis and their families who need an advocate that will raise awareness toward a team approach to solving the serious problems associated with this condition. And while he was away doing these things - comments allowed in public forum were not what one would expect to see from the very people he is helping. The very fact that the comments you mention have been made, and been allowed to be made - is a true disservice to Joe and completely undeserved.

    Writer - I support your comments 100%.

    Also think this would be a good thread for all those who are appreciative of Joe's efforts ... to show their support.

    Thank you Joe!

  4. #4
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    What has happened to this forum??

    I totally agree with the writer, this site has unfortunately turned into a forum for people to argue and critisize. I believe that most of us need this forum for support and advice. I can't speak for anyone else but I haven't posted for several months because I don't feel comfortable enough on this forum, too much negativity and tension!!!!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptalana View Post
    I totally agree with the writer, this site has unfortunately turned into a forum for people to argue and critisize. I believe that most of us need this forum for support and advice. I can't speak for anyone else but I haven't posted for several months because I don't feel comfortable enough on this forum, too much negativity and tension!!!!
    I agree, sometimes I don't post too just for the simple reason that then I'll have to defend and defend and defend whatever I'm saying...even if I'm not making wild claims, etc. That's not a discussion, or fun, or a nice forum, or encouraging. It's the exact opposite of what this forum is supposed to be all about.

  6. #6
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    I am also in total agreement with writer. I still read the forum, but no longer post because I have no interest in being ridiculed & bullied for voicing my opinion.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Writer View Post
    Linda, I request -- again -- that you control the very few people who are consistently out of control, disrupting discussions and alienating many participants with sarcastic or wild remarks, taking over threads, including now the President’s thread, and casting aspersions upon the President himself.
    Writer...

    If someone posted untruths about me, I'd handle that, but Joe is a big boy, and can control whatever he sees fit.

    While some individuals definitely have a tendency to be disruptive, they also have the ability to provide useful input. If you don't like what they say, please feel free to engage in the debate. Making them go away will not end the debate, which I believe is the true motive for a request to "control" others.

    Sorry.

    Regards,
    Linda

  8. #8
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    The degeneration af that thread was disgraceful. It was like watching an episode of Jerry Springer that just never ended.

    I am sure that 99% of members here are not gullible idiots, but they are treated that way sometimes, by some members.

    As a newbie, I have found some of the threads toxic. What I wish is that highly knowledgeble people would share their knowledge with kindness.

    B.
    Last edited by betty14; 07-01-2009 at 06:46 PM.
    Bettina:
    - 34 year old physiotherapist
    - main curve of 3 is mid-thoracic convex, approx 37 d.
    - my goal: to stay as upright, strong and painfree as I can, as long as I can.

  9. #9
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    I respectfully disagree with Linda's response. For one thing, I cannot imagine that Joe wants to dive in whenever his intellect is questioned. He's got bigger issues to take care of.

    Also, this place should not be a free-for-all. You will see from the plaintive tone of several previous responses to my post that people think my assessment is right on the money. I had had no prior contact with half the above respondents.

    You have stated in another thread that your job is to ensure that false information is not disseminated here. I disagree again. Who's to determine what is false? You and pooka?

    The job of the NSF Forum moderator is to ensure that the NSF president's directives are adhered to. But they are flagrantly ignored every day by a small minority. If I or mamamax or anybody else protests, here we go again, another nasty argument with the usual suspects, and other members less willing to engage just drop out. It's futile for anybody except the moderator to intervene.

    As for the suggestion that my motive in posting is to end debates, false, absolutely false. I am happy to engage in a productive debate where I can learn something useful. It is the TONE of the debates I want to end, as does every respondent so far besides yourself. The debates here tend far too often to be sarcastic, derogatory, personal attacks and so on. Two members in particular, those whose nicks I named, are perpetrators in a high proportion of their posts. Virtually everybody else is civil.
    Last edited by Writer; 07-01-2009 at 06:49 PM.

  10. #10
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    Agree with you again Writer. Betty14 has also made some accurate observations. A toxic environment is not what patients and families need, in fact what has gone on is counterproductive to the purpose of this forum which is to support those in need. Toxic communication in fact drives many in need away and casts a bad light on the forum's reputation. Betty's comparison to the Jerry Springer show was spot on. And your observation that the job of the NSF Forum moderator is to ensure that the NSF president's directives are adhered to, could not have been better put.

    If the too often sarcastic, derogatory, personal attack type "debates" do not end, then I fear a platform created to assist those in need will cease to exist because those who could make a difference through contribution will not bother to do so amid an atmosphere of hostility. Wouldn't it be nice to see someone like Martha Hawes contribute here? An impossibility at this time, the stage is not yet set - and the environment far too hostile and counterproductive.

  11. #11
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    I feel the same as the others. I have not posted much recently. I have been in the "HOT SEAT" and frankly would rather have a root canal. I only come here now to keep up on new info. This is a long hard journey for all of us. I would like to see it like it was before. People bouncing ideas and information off each other.
    from CT, USA
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  12. #12
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    I agree and would just like to say that for those of us who post predominantly in the "non surgical" section of the forum, we all know that's not the most popular area on the forum necessarily. This forum is mainly targeted and geared toward surgical procedures, people who have been fused, etc. That's totally fine, but since many of the members who would normally post/reply in the "non surgical" section are now "scared" to post/reply and share their opinions, that leaves a small portion of the extreme surgery advocates to reply in the "non surgical" section...not exactly who I (or probably most people posting in the "non surgical" section) like to receive the majority of the feedback from.
    Last edited by MissEmmyF; 07-01-2009 at 09:52 PM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by mamamax View Post
    Agree with you again Writer. Betty14 has also made some accurate observations. A toxic environment is not what patients and families need, in fact what has gone on is counterproductive to the purpose of this forum which is to support those in need. Toxic communication in fact drives many in need away and casts a bad light on the forum's reputation. Betty's comparison to the Jerry Springer show was spot on. And your observation that the job of the NSF Forum moderator is to ensure that the NSF president's directives are adhered to, could not have been better put.

    If the too often sarcastic, derogatory, personal attack type "debates" do not end, then I fear a platform created to assist those in need will cease to exist because those who could make a difference through contribution will not bother to do so amid an atmosphere of hostility. Wouldn't it be nice to see someone like Martha Hawes contribute here? An impossibility at this time, the stage is not yet set - and the environment far too hostile and counterproductive.
    Mamamax ... I hope in your "heart of hearts", you can at least acknowledge you have thrown more than the usual share of oxygen into the fire since your very first posts (and all the ones you deleted ... shall I link to them again?).

    Writer, I don't even know what to say to you (I gave that up long ago). You push a treatment that has no proof, and I simply can't ever take your grandstanding that seriously.

    The rest of you can like me or not. I'm realistic ... and for all of you who claim I'm a big mean bully, there are just as many who perceive me differently.

    I really think the problem is I don't agree with foo-foo treatments, and some can't stand to believe they ARE foo-foo. There is no miracle, alt, easy treatment ... and to take it personally everytime someone points that out is setting yourself up for a MAJOR letdown.

    It's not in my nature to let false treatment claims stand: I've lived with this monster for 31 years, and I'd be remiss to let some of the misinformation here stand.

    I'll agree to trying to state things more kindly if some others will agree to respond to anything short of being hit over the head with facts.

    Regards,
    Pam
    Fusion is NOT the end of the world.
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  14. #14
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    I believe there are different sections for a reason. Those who do not agree with things in one section need to leave the section and have healthy discussions in a section where their advice will actually be helpful. Most of us are emotionally driven in this area of our lives and debates do not help in finding answers and support. Discussions help. Discussions are the exchange of words between people with similar issues, ideas, and thoughts in common. I sort of agree with Linda that some users on here should not be booted out. They do have some good advice. I just wish they would use it in the proper section where it is useful to those who need it.

  15. #15
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    Hi Christi....

    If you want a discussion on alternative treatments, where only those who agree are allowed to post, you might want to try www.fixscoliosis.com.

    In terms of the NSF forums, if/when anyone attacks an individual as opposed to attacking an idea, I definitely will step in.

    --Linda

    P.S.
    dis⋅cus⋅sion  [di-skuhsh-uhn]
    –noun
    an act or instance of discussing; consideration or examination by argument, comment, etc., esp. to explore solutions; informal debate.
    Last edited by LindaRacine; 07-02-2009 at 10:24 PM.

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