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  • #61
    I don't believe thatKaren was telling people that Chiropractic causes stroke. She was simply providing the information given by a professional body, the Canadian Paediatric Society.

    Alison

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    • #62
      as for that Northlandmed person...

      Glad he or she is gone. NOT a representation of chiropractic. And that is my feeling on Karen and her surgery encouraging. I am not ignorant. I know why people are leary of chiropractors...but just like someone quoted "there are med docs wanting to operate on minor curves"...there are also chiros who know nothing about scoliosis who try to treat it. again, get referrals, get referrals, get referrals! This condition it too tough to risk with just anyone. But don't let anyone tell you not to consider your options. I am disturbed by the harrington rod method...but I would still be thrilled to hear if someone had it and it worked for them...LONG TERM...not just in their teen years. just talk people...don't tell others not to post options. I posted about my very positive experience w/chiro and Karen took my head off. just like that northlandmed person...just tune those people out.
      Katie- age 28
      Ironman Triathlete in Training
      Love the outdoors, my family, rescue dogs, and this wonderful challenge of scoliosis which has shaped who I am today
      Diagnosed with scoliosis at 12 Braced '92-'94
      Curves before chiropactic care: 47 thoracic, 45 lumbar, no cervical curve, lots of pain
      With chiro so far reduced to 32 thoracic, 31 lumbar a beautiful cervical curve, 175% inc lung capacity, 401% inc range of motion, 1/2 in taller balanced legs pain free and only getting better.

      Comment


      • #63
        I am growing increasingly tired of your posts that are getting increasingly ruder as you go on.

        As for your last statement,
        But the decision has to be yours. your body, your decision,
        , please start practicing what you you just said because I have now witnessed in several of your posts telling people that they DO NOT want surgery.

        Thank you.
        36 year old single mom of teens ages 14 & 15.
        Anterior/posterior spinal fusion on February 9th & 16th 2006 with Dr. Anthony Moreno who now has his own practice.
        Fused from T-3 to S-1 (sacrum)
        Curve pre-op = 70 degrees
        Curve post op = 20 degrees
        No pain anymore!!
        Google is your friend

        I am not a doctor and will never give medical advice. I will support and answer questions from personal experience only.

        Comment


        • #64
          Harrington Rods are rarely used these days.

          Would you consider 6 years "long term", I had fusion surgery in 1999 (and no it was not with Harrington Rods) and 6 years on my fusion is still 'fused' and I'm very happy with my rods, and their is very, very little I am not able to do. My life is as 'normal' as the next persons

          Alison
          Last edited by Alison; 01-19-2006, 09:59 PM.

          Comment


          • #65
            Yes Alison- I would consider that a success! just as I wrote before. Good for you as I have said over and over I am for anything that works. One thing people keep forgetting is we are on here to learn from each other. I only get upset when grown adults tell kids not to waste their time and just to get surgery. That is not a decision to be made lightly by a stranger online. Additionally, you may not have used them, but H rods are still widely in use, as I personally know a doc here in Denver that does hundreds of them a year.

            Katblack- I am sorry you feel that way. I have made countless efforts on here to say that I am open to talking with you, but it is obvious the only thing you want to talk about is surgery success and nothing else. as a matter of fact, this exact thread is dedicated non-surgical treatment...even though my last post openly said I believe in both! but I see you cannot accept that, and anyone with differing opinons from you is "rude." If you don't like me stop following my posts, because I have had other people on here email me thanking me for advice. If it doesn't help you then please leave me alone. as I have told you twice before, you do what works for you and I will do what works for me. That is not "rude", I find your following me thread to thread and bashing me "rude." I have not ONCE told you not to get surgery...as a matter of fact I kindly said I would pray for you for your surgery on the 9th. And you reply to me like this?... I don't think that is fair.
            Katie- age 28
            Ironman Triathlete in Training
            Love the outdoors, my family, rescue dogs, and this wonderful challenge of scoliosis which has shaped who I am today
            Diagnosed with scoliosis at 12 Braced '92-'94
            Curves before chiropactic care: 47 thoracic, 45 lumbar, no cervical curve, lots of pain
            With chiro so far reduced to 32 thoracic, 31 lumbar a beautiful cervical curve, 175% inc lung capacity, 401% inc range of motion, 1/2 in taller balanced legs pain free and only getting better.

            Comment


            • #66
              Katblack- I am sorry you feel that way. I have made countless efforts on here to say that I am open to talking with you, but it is obvious the only thing you want to talk about is surgery success and nothing else. as a matter of fact, this exact thread is dedicated non-surgical treatment...even though my last post openly said I believe in both! but I see you cannot accept that, and anyone with differing opinions from you is "rude." If you don't like me stop following my posts, because I have had other people on here email me thanking me for advice. If it doesn't help you then please leave me alone. as I have told you twice before, you do what works for you and I will do what works for me. That is not "rude", I find your following me thread to thread and bashing me "rude." I have not ONCE told you not to get surgery...as a matter of fact I kindly said I would pray for you for your surgery on the 9th. And you reply to me like this?... I don't think that is fair.
              I want to talk about surgery success because I am having it. I am asking questions of people who have had it. I tried chiro, it did not work. It was going to be a lifelong treatment plan and that is crap. I need the pain gone now not deal with everyday, spend 3 days a week in an office being manipulated and still be in pain for the rest of my life.

              It's not the differing opinions are rude, what I find rude is that you keep telling people to not get surgery. That they do not want it. How do you know what people want or need?

              And, I'm not following you thread to thread. I am clicking that link up there that says new posts and reading and replying to them no matter what forum they are in.

              You want to pray for me? Go right ahead but my mother has been going to church and praying for me to get relief from this since i was 12 and no god has replied but a doctor did.
              36 year old single mom of teens ages 14 & 15.
              Anterior/posterior spinal fusion on February 9th & 16th 2006 with Dr. Anthony Moreno who now has his own practice.
              Fused from T-3 to S-1 (sacrum)
              Curve pre-op = 70 degrees
              Curve post op = 20 degrees
              No pain anymore!!
              Google is your friend

              I am not a doctor and will never give medical advice. I will support and answer questions from personal experience only.

              Comment


              • #67
                katback, This person is not worth wasting time on. We had another one just like her during the holiday season. I agree with you. You don't want to have to have treatment the rest of your life, which is the case with anything that might suggest chiro treatment. We took our daughter to the chiro for a year and a half. Her curve never got better, only worse, and she was in continuous pain, like you. She had her surgery and says she would do it over again if she had to. She lives a full and complete normal life. There isn't anything she can't do after having surgery. Just ignore this person, as she will leave people alone. As far as letting a teenager decide what they wanted to do about their back. We let Crystal make the call on her back surgery as she is the one that lives in pain daily, not us. She was pleased with her decision and is now pain free. It was worth it to her.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by nikyergen
                  katback, This person is not worth wasting time on. We had another one just like her during the holiday season. I agree with you. You don't want to have to have treatment the rest of your life, which is the case with anything that might suggest chiro treatment. We took our daughter to the chiro for a year and a half. Her curve never got better, only worse, and she was in continuous pain, like you. She had her surgery and says she would do it over again if she had to. She lives a full and complete normal life. There isn't anything she can't do after having surgery. Just ignore this person, as she will leave people alone. As far as letting a teenager decide what they wanted to do about their back. We let Crystal make the call on her back surgery as she is the one that lives in pain daily, not us. She was pleased with her decision and is now pain free. It was worth it to her.
                  Nikki,
                  Being so new to this board, how old was she when she started chiro? How old was she at the time of her surgery?
                  Can she do all kinds of things now? I want to be able to get back to being able to do things with my kids again.
                  We used to go to Busch Gardens and ride the rides and go bike riding and all kinds of stuff and for years now, I haven't been able to do anything.
                  I've lost years of their life as well. It makes me sad.

                  When I was diagnosed at 12, I was given PT at school 3 days a week. Pulled out of 7th grade class, spent 45 minutes doing exercises and then the pt said after a few months, that my back looked straighter and she was going to recommend signing off on me. She did. My ortho at the time did a set of xrays, said he didn't feel my scoli would progress any further and told my parents to let it go. This was 1982.
                  I have always had back pain as far back as I can remember and I started seeing chiros on my own when I turned 18 for just the back pain. I had several tell me I had scoli and that they could fix/help me.

                  I would go for years to chiros and then stop because it wasn't working and I would get fed up but I never realized that it was my scoli causing me all that pain. I would do this (chiro visits off and on) for years until I finally had enough and saw another ortho at age 30. I was devastated to learn how bad I had progressed.

                  Not once in all those years of seeing chiros did a single one tell me how bad I had gotten. They had been doing xrays at their offices on me. They were doing flexibility tests and all kinds of things but not a single one told me how bad I truly was.
                  They just kept taking my money and telling me they could help.
                  After being told I would need chiro for the rest of my life is when I went and saw an ortho and learned the horrible truth.

                  I'm angry. You have no idea how angry I am.
                  Years of my life in pain, years being crooked and deformed and I mean, deformed. My surgeon who is doing my surgery called my curves and impairments, severe deformity. I cried. I thought back over all the years of chiros telling me they could help when all along they were seeing the constant progression and deterioration of my spine and nerves and destruction of discs and joints and they did not tell me the truth.

                  If people want to try chiro, go ahead but don't expect a miracle cure, don't expect to be told the truth about it's progression. they want your money, they want patients for life.

                  I almost feel like suing the last chiro who basically robbed me $50 a visit, 3x a week for 3 years and didn't help me at all and possibly may have even contributed to the deterioration of my spine, discs, joints and nerves.
                  I can't imagine that cracking my joints and twisting me the way he did helped with all the nerve damage I have now.
                  I have nerves that are completely severed going down into my left leg. I lose feeling in it, it turns purple from lack of blood flow.
                  I can't help but think, what if he did that? What if with all his twisting and cracking and manipulating my back the way he did, caused that?

                  If a person wants to try chiro, go ahead but get a second opinion, even a third. Don't just take one chiro or even one orthos word for it. Get multiple opinions before deciding any one type of treatment.
                  I would hate for anyone, especially a teenager, to suffer years and years of pain the way I did thinking all along that it's helping and then to learn the horrible, awful truth someday like I did.
                  36 year old single mom of teens ages 14 & 15.
                  Anterior/posterior spinal fusion on February 9th & 16th 2006 with Dr. Anthony Moreno who now has his own practice.
                  Fused from T-3 to S-1 (sacrum)
                  Curve pre-op = 70 degrees
                  Curve post op = 20 degrees
                  No pain anymore!!
                  Google is your friend

                  I am not a doctor and will never give medical advice. I will support and answer questions from personal experience only.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Katback, Crystal has had obvious signs of scoli since she was very young. However, her peditrician never thought anything about it. By the time we got a diagnosis on it her curve was quite large. She was 13-14 years old when she started chiro techniques. We did them for a year and a half with nothing but progression, and faster than we thought. When we took her into the ortho at almost 16, her curve had progressed to 82 degrees. She had surgery on 3/15/05. She was in pain everyday, but didn't stop doing the things she enjoyed, like playing high school basketball. She took naproxin, tylenol and ibuprophene daily, which is really hard on a persons body. The day she came out of surgery she told me that she hurt from the surgical site itself, not from her back. She said it was a completely different kind of pain. Today, she is allowed to do anything she wants. The only thing the doctor hasn't released her to do yet, but will this Spring, is going back to playing high school ball. Her biggest complaint, we live in a very cold climate and her back gets cold easily, but she said she'd rather have her back cold than hurt continuously like before. She is 17 now and goes 100 miles an hour. She rides 4 wheelers, bikes, her horse, works her sheep and cattle, swims, runs, has a job at McDonald's, etc., etc., etc. She is doing wonderful.

                    I feel like you - successful treatment is not something you have to continue to have done the rest of your life. Let's figure one years cost also at your costs $55 x 3 times per week = $165 x 52 weeks = $8,580 per year for the rest of your life and you are 35 and should have another good 45 years left in you. So, $8,850 x 45 years = $386,100. That figure doesn't figure in the cost of inflation as the years go on. I could see that costing well over $500,000 by the time you get to an age you may not use it anymore. Maybe less expensive on the immediate note, but look at the out of pocket in the long run. Pretty expensive treatment, when you have to do it the rest of your life.

                    Also, Chiropractors are not real medical doctors. They don't go through the training that a medical doctor or specialist has had, therefore aren't really qualified, like a specialist would be. People are fooled because they have Dr. in front of their name.

                    I'm not against Chiropractors, because we do use them for sports medicine on our kids and, believe it or not, our horses. But, with three kids with scoliosis, we use the Pediatric Orthopedic Specialist. The specialist is trained in the area we need them in.

                    As with any surgery, there are risks. But, you have to weigh those risks and decide if you are willing to take them. Crystal weighed those risks and was willing to take them. Oh, some might say, why did we let a teeenager make her own decision on surgery. It's her back, her body, and she was the one that lived with the pain daily. She was one miserable kid.

                    By the way, for the record, the doctor was able to get over 60% correction on her back and she grew two inches from having it corrected. She is no longer the shortest person in our family. Yeah.

                    Do remember, because you aren't a kid anymore, recovery will be long and hard. You will have to learn how to stand up and sit down differently, picking things up will be different too, bending over will be a whole new experience to you. But, as Crystal says "It's worth it and I'd do it again in a heartbeat."

                    Hope this helps and sheds some light on your upcoming experience. Remember, each case is different and there are no hard and fast rules on recovery.

                    Nikki

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Thank you. I know it's going to be hard and different and I'm not gonna lie, I'm scared. I know my body has compensated all these years for the twist of my spine and shortness of leg etc. I'm game for it but scared. I will get through it and I know now after finding this site, that I can talk to others that have been where I'm going and that makes it so much easier to deal with.
                      36 year old single mom of teens ages 14 & 15.
                      Anterior/posterior spinal fusion on February 9th & 16th 2006 with Dr. Anthony Moreno who now has his own practice.
                      Fused from T-3 to S-1 (sacrum)
                      Curve pre-op = 70 degrees
                      Curve post op = 20 degrees
                      No pain anymore!!
                      Google is your friend

                      I am not a doctor and will never give medical advice. I will support and answer questions from personal experience only.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        biggest joke ever

                        "Also, Chiropractors are not real medical doctors. They don't go through the training that a medical doctor or specialist has had, therefore aren't really qualified, like a specialist would be. People are fooled because they have Dr. in front of their name."


                        You have got to be kidding me. You haven't a clue. what "other kind of me" was around during the holidays? Someone with a brain?! I can tell you all fear that. Of couse they are not medical docs...they don't wish to be! but they are in school exactly as long, work just as hard, and are just as trained! the only difference is they don't treat with drugs or surgery..."real medical docs" prescribe drugs...which can help people, but can also kill people. this is the ignorance I referenced before and why I am out of here. ...oh and the biggest difference b/t a chiro and an md is they spend their life responding to thankless people like you and justifying their existance...take a walk thru a chiro school and see just what they have to go through for that 8 yr degree.

                        Katblack, I feel your pain, just wish you would READ. I wished you luck on your surgery a million times now! where's the thanks. why do you keep telling me I am telling you to go to chiro...obviously it did not work for you and you need to move on, but that does not mean other people have to give up on it too. stop crushing people's beliefs, and stop putting words in my mouth.
                        Katie- age 28
                        Ironman Triathlete in Training
                        Love the outdoors, my family, rescue dogs, and this wonderful challenge of scoliosis which has shaped who I am today
                        Diagnosed with scoliosis at 12 Braced '92-'94
                        Curves before chiropactic care: 47 thoracic, 45 lumbar, no cervical curve, lots of pain
                        With chiro so far reduced to 32 thoracic, 31 lumbar a beautiful cervical curve, 175% inc lung capacity, 401% inc range of motion, 1/2 in taller balanced legs pain free and only getting better.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Katblack,
                          It is normal to be scared. I was actually more scared than Crystal. I pulled a lot of strength from her. But, after it was all said and done, I wondered what I was so worried about. Crystal did finally get scared the night before surgery, but felt at ease after the all the various doctors and nurses came in to see her.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            I know it's normal and I really do apologize for being so "chatty"...lol
                            I talk a lot when nervous.
                            I just feel so old sometimes.
                            It's like I'm 35 chronologically, 25 mentally and 80 physically.

                            I will get through it all especially with the great support and information I have found here with all of you.
                            Reading peoples blogs where they post their success stories and pictures is awesome. Reading all the success stories here is awesome.
                            I just want to get it done now.
                            It's finally happening after all these years.
                            36 year old single mom of teens ages 14 & 15.
                            Anterior/posterior spinal fusion on February 9th & 16th 2006 with Dr. Anthony Moreno who now has his own practice.
                            Fused from T-3 to S-1 (sacrum)
                            Curve pre-op = 70 degrees
                            Curve post op = 20 degrees
                            No pain anymore!!
                            Google is your friend

                            I am not a doctor and will never give medical advice. I will support and answer questions from personal experience only.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Originally posted by denverbackchic
                              You spend your day on here thread to thread bashing chiros on every page. you are telling people that chiropractic casues stroke???
                              There are reported cases of vertebral artery dissection due to chiropractic adjustments. VAD can cause strokes.

                              Of couse they are not medical docs...they don't wish to be! but they are in school exactly as long, work just as hard, and are just as trained! the only difference is they don't treat with drugs or surgery...
                              Chiropractic medicine does not have residencies. Yeah they have clinical rotations like any other health profession but not as long as allopathic/osteopathic medicines. So technically MD/DOs train for 3 - 4 years longer.

                              I'm not posting this in response to you, I'm posting this so the others who read this board will be better informed.
                              30 something y.o.

                              2003 - T45, L???
                              2005 - T50, L31
                              bunch of measurements between...

                              2011 - T60, L32
                              2013 - T68, L?

                              Posterior Fusion Sept 2014 -- T3 - L3
                              Post - op curve ~35


                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Jumping in ...

                                I've been reading this thread with interest. I'm a newbie to this site, but not to scoliosis. I was diagnosed with it in 7th grade, and had to wear a Milwaukee brace until I graduated from high school (22 hours/day at first, then eventually just every other night). It ruined my life. Helped my scoliosis, yes, but the social and emotional toll still affects me today. (And I know, better to have been fixed physically so I won't suffer worse things later, but it was still h-e-double-hockey-sticks).

                                I'm 43 now. Went to a chiro for the first time several months ago for back pain, and they did x-rays. When I finished the brace, my degrees of curvature (I have the S-curve) were in the mid-twenties. Now I'm into the lower thirties. I don't know if the chiro care will work in the long run or not, but I do know that it has improved my flexibility like you wouldn't believe.

                                I have a very compassionate set of chiropractors, and, of course, they seem extremely knowledgeable. They're not out for my money (which I worried about at first) because, when my insurance ran out on chiro for the year and I said I couldn't afford three times a week anymore, not only did they reduce the amount of my payments, but they're giving me one day a week as a freebie, no charge at all. I truly believe they want to help me get better.

                                My problem is this: My almost-13-year-old son went with me the other day and they x-rayed him. To my utter dismay, he has the beginnings of scoliosis. They hadn't measured the curves yet, but they're there, it's plain to see. Of course, they want to treat him to prevent it from getting worse. I really like these people and I believe they can do great things. But I also don't want to mess things up for my son. Here's what I'm afraid of -- I'm afraid to go to a regular orthopedist and have them recommend that he wear a brace. I can't imagine having to put him through that kind of social and emotional toll at such a formative stage of his life. I don't want him to have the same kinds of emotional scars I still have. Nor do I want him to have surgery (although at this point it doesn't look bad enough for that). Obviously if it's the only option, I would go with that for him. But I want to explore whatever else there might be before I commit to anything that would have long-term ramifications on his psyche, or involve surgery.

                                So, surely there are some positive experiences with chiropractic? Or maybe this is the wrong thread (or forum) in which to post this. I do see a lot of chiro-bashing here, and I believe, just as someone said, there are good chiros and there are bad ones, just as there are good MDs and bad ones. And for the person who went through chiro in the 1950s, I would think that, just like all other forms of medical treatment, things have improved since then!

                                Anyway, not sure really what I'm trying to say, but I want to believe that these people who have been so awesome and helpful to me also have my son's best interests at heart. However, I realize that may not be good enough or the right thing to do. I know that if we go to an orthopedist, he/she is going to totally scoff at chiro and tell us to chuck that whole idea and do whatever they (the ortho) prescribes.

                                I feel caught in the middle ... can anyone with a balanced opinion offer me any advice?

                                Thanks!
                                Aidan's mom

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