Take out rods???

[Jen Q]

Hi Mocity.

I had Rod put in in 1985 at age 17 I am now 38 things have gone really well for me up until the last three or four months with a severe increase in pain

My Doc recomended rods stay in as to dangerous to remove I have a full length rod with only about 3 vertibrae remaining unfused, these have significant wear. I have been desperate to find some form of relief as the pain has been unbearable.
I have began diet changes that include low acid diet this has helped significantly, from what I understand this works similar to the principle of how a diet high in acids often causes a person who suffers from gout to have re occuring bouts. I have cut out all sugar as my father said this eliminated a large amount of his pain that was due to bad arthritis. I had severe pain in the left hip that kept me awake most of the night this has all but stopped I can tell you I am most grateful. The pain in my back is also asociated with a large amount of swelling all down the left side from under my rib down to just past my hip I have spoken with numerous people in the natural profession that have said this can be a sign of low magnesium / minerals which can cause muscle spasm hence the pain.I think those of you that have lived with severe pain know that in the end you are willing to try all sorts of things in search of some form of relief especially when the medical proffesion has done all they can. I hope I dont sound like a nut but these things have definitley helped. I have noticed I need to be quite strict to get consistent results Maybe try consulting a naturopath for ideas you may not agree with all of them but you can pick and choose the things you wish to try and find what works for you.

All the best I hope some of this may help

[jo1979]

RE Removal of rod

Hi

I had a spinal fusion in 1993 and in 1996 i had my rod removed, my surgeons reason was that is was "tought" that was it!
I have been great, i have a 4year old son and the pregancy was fine.
Last year however i began to get upper back pain and noticed that my clothes were hanging different, my partner and parents agreed.
I have since been back to see my consultant and he said that i have de-generative area where i am saying the pain is. But he seemed puzzled as to why it is like it there as it is meant to be fused? he also thinks that i have started to re-curve but never had an old xray to compare.
I have since had physio and only had three sessions as the physio thinks it's more a joint problem than a muscle problem (which i already know!)
I am due to see the consultant again on 13th April, i just want an end to this pain and constant pill popping! as i said i have a child a day to day life is really hard going somedays! Still i know that there are people much worse of than myself!!

My opinion to anyone thinking about having their rod removed is to seriously think about it. If i knew that this would be happening 10 years later i might of thought twice. I am only 26 years old and would like to think that the old spine has many a good few years left!!

Sorry to go on and on!!

[LindaRacine]

Here's a new study abstract on this topic:

Spine. 2006 Jan 1;31(1):67-72.

Loss of coronal correction following instrumentation removal in adolescent idiopathic scoliosis.

Potter BK, Kirk KL, Shah SA, Kuklo TR.

Department of Orthopaedics and Rehabilitation, Walter Reed Army Medical Center, Washington, DC 20307, USA.

STUDY DESIGN: Retrospective radiographic analysis of patients with adolescent idiopathic scoliosis (AIS) status after instrumentation removal. OBJECTIVE: To evaluate the effect of instrumentation removal in surgically corrected AIS. SUMMARY OF BACKGROUND DATA: Spinal instrumentation is occasionally removed for various reasons, most commonly for postoperative pain or infection, in surgically corrected AIS. The fate of instrumentation removal in adults has been previously reported with documented loss of sagittal alignment. However, to our knowledge, the long-term follow-up after instrumentation removal in AIS has not been reported. METHODS: We retrospectively reviewed the preoperative, pre-instrumentation removal, postoperative following instrumentation removal, and latest follow-up radiographs of all patients with a primary diagnosis of AIS who underwent instrumentation removal after posterior spinal fusion. There were 21 patients (15 females, 6 males) from 2 institutions, at an average age of 14.8 years (range 9-19), who were originally treated between 1988 and 2002. Instrumentation removal occurred at an average of 2.4 years after surgery (range 8 months to 4 years, 2 months), with an average follow-up of 5.2 years (range 2-11). Fifteen patients underwent removal secondary to pain (2 of these with undetected infection) and 6 for known infection. Evaluation included coronal proximal thoracic, main thoracic, thoracolumbar/lumbar (TL/L), and sagittal T2-T5, T5-T12, T2-T12, T10-L2, T12-S1, and sagittal balance before surgery, before instrumentation removal, at immediate post-removal evaluation, and at latest follow-up. RESULTS: There were 12 main thoracic curves (Lenke type 1), 6 double thoracic curves (Lenke type 2), and 3 double major curves (Lenke type 3) in the series. Average proximal thoracic curve was 19.7 degrees (range 5 degrees -35 degrees ), the main thoracic curve 63.3 (range 42 degrees -112 degrees ), and the TL-L curve averaged 31.4 degrees (range 17 degrees -53 degrees ). There was an immediate loss of approximately 4 degrees (range 0 degrees -8 degrees ) in the main thoracic curve and 6 degrees (range 1 degrees -15 degrees ) in the TL/L curve after removal, with continued settling of an additional 6 degrees (10 degrees total, P = 0.002) in the main thoracic curve, and 3 degrees in the TL/L curve (9 degrees total, P = 0.01). There was also a significant difference in the group that underwent instrumentation removal <2 years after surgery compared to >2 years (main thoracic curve 13 degrees vs. 7 degrees , P = 0.017; TL/L 11 degrees vs. 7 degrees , P = 0.036). There were no significant changes in sagittal curvature or sagittal balance in either group (P > 0.39). CONCLUSIONS: Instrumentation removal in AIS is not always a benign process because the long-term follow-up of this cohort of patients shows a "settling" effect in the coronal plane of the main thoracic and TL/L curves after instrumentation removal. Interestingly, there was no change in the sagittal plane with time. Parents and patients should be counseled for this result when instrumentation removal is contemplated, and limited removal of focally symptomatic implants should be considered.

[sweetness514]

The low acid diet and cutting on bad sugar and carbs I have found help for any type of pain, as well as not eating too much. When I do, or eat a lot of tomato based foods, it gives me acid and back pain.

The thing about rod removal is a hard one. If we have them taken out, there is a risk of the curve returning. If we get them replaced in case of a rod breakage(like I just have had done), there is a chance that the rod can break again later on, if the fusion fails.

[crystals4502]

hi i have a broken fusion with my one rod poking out of my back you can see it actually sticking out. i had surgery whaen i was 13 i am now 25. my fusion broke at 1 year after surgery.i have been dealing with pain since then and it has been something i was dealing with leading a normal life until the correction kept getting worse. i had a 83 degree at the top and a 40 at the bottom. over time things just kept getting out of place. about 2 years ago is when the rod started to poke through. and the pain just got worse and was getting harder to deal with. i never heard of getting the rods removed either until i found this website. last year i finally broke down and went to the doc due to the fact that the first surgery was enough pain i didnt want to do it again. the doc ordered therpy. didnt work. next step would be to have 3 surgerys!!! needless to say i got a second opinion. this doc could fix me in 1 sugery. take the rods out break fuison and put new rods in. all in one. he also said that discs are also prob out due to lower back pain which u are having also since the fusion is broke it is no longer holding the discs in place. so what i am trying to say is it has been done many times and i wish i would of had mine fixed long ago instead of putting it off until now due to the fact that the rods are ten times worse now then when i first started to have the pain. its a tough decsion Good luck

[mattie]

Take out rods???

Crystals4502
I wish you the best. Finding a good Dr. and one you trust is the most inportant thing in my opinion. I know some of us put off having surgery until we have no choice. I know I did. No one wants to be cut on especially more than once. I hope everything turns out great for you. It is a tough decision to make.
Mattie

[rmcginnnis]

I had my first surgery in 1989 also. Two years later I had to have the rods removed because my body was rejecting them and caused an infection. I have had regular check ups and there has been no curve progression at all. I recently took part in a patient study of people who had their rods removed to see if there were any progressions. There were about 50 of us and the report I received after the study said that more than half of the patients had curve progression and needed to seek medical care. I was one of the lucky ones I guess. I have chronic back pain. It seems to get worse as the years go by, but there's not really much to do for it except for Ibuprofen.

[Alaskan]

15 years of hardware is part of you!

Hello mocity,

Like you I had my surgery in 1989. I had pretty much all of my spine fused exept for the lower three vertebre. I have broken hardware (in my lower spine) and my sugeon suggested having all of it taken out and new hardware put in! Having had my c d instrumentation in for that long has me concerned. I'm going to pain managment and it is working for me. I'm only 31, so i am constantly thinking about the long term effects of medication! My lower back did not fuse, my doctor said my spine is progressing at 2 degree per year (main curve is 60 degree) so it's a matter of when, not if! All i know is i'm terrified of having another 24" incision on my back and the pain, and the what ifs! I understand your concern for rod removal, good luck and god bless!! Chris

Prncess, you are one tough person! Hope you feel better!

[PNUTTRO]

Hi mocity

Have you gotten a second, third, opinion?