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Thread: Does anyone know anything about this?

  1. #1
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    Does anyone know anything about this?


  2. #2
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    Here's the whole article.

    https://www.facebook.com/TreatingSco...type=1&theater

    Many questions, the most obvious being how many people with TL curves did that EXACT treatment and didn't improve? Are these the only two? This might be like the Italian group wherein they report one case study that was successful out of who knows how many that weren't.

    Also, I would want those angles measured by someone else. It appears one twin just learned to stand differently, perhaps just for the later radiograph.

    I'd also be curious if they checked the girls were actually identical. Self reportage of zygosity of twins is notoriously inaccurate.
    Last edited by Pooka1; 01-08-2016 at 11:30 PM.
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

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    Who knows.. is true it seems to be standing different, but I use to trust in Pubmed, I supposed they check everything before, or not? If not we must to doubt about thousands of articles.. It would be important if this case is true even if it would be the only one. It would imply that something done was good and should to be taken into account, in adults is difficult to believe in spontaneous corrections.
    I think that the own inventions of Clear (like traction chair) by their own, may only work during growth spurt, something very much different is SEAS, that case surely is the most amazing but not the only one as a study showed.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by flerc View Post
    Who knows.. is true it seems to be standing different, but I use to trust in Pubmed, I supposed they check everything before, or not?
    Pubmed checks nothing. They only list articles.

    If not we must to doubt about thousands of articles..
    Yes doubt them. Most published articles in the medical literature and other literatures are probably false.

    It would be important if this case is true even if it would be the only one. It would imply that something done was good and should to be taken into account, in adults is difficult to believe in spontaneous corrections.
    It would imply any improvement was not likely related to the treatment. Recall we are talking chiro here. Chiro is not a science and is based on an imaginary concept.

    They are claiming both these girls did treatment at home three times a day for TWO YEARS. I am skeptical they did all that treatment at home.

    I think that the own inventions of Clear (like traction chair) by their own, may only work during growth spurt, something very much different is SEAS, that case surely is the most amazing but not the only one as a study showed.
    It remains to be seen if any PT treatment will last a lifetime.
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

  5. #5
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    This outfit is Scolismart!!

    They continually spout things like this.

    What evidence do we have that their curves were progressing etc. They could both have non- progressive curves and the result is a combination of different measuring for the 'after' and standing differently for the 'after'

    What they don't have is any evidence that their treatments work in the long-term- they are only interested in publishing comfort stats to lure people into their costly treatment program.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by burdle View Post
    This outfit is Scolismart!!

    They continually spout things like this.

    What evidence do we have that their curves were progressing etc. They could both have non- progressive curves and the result is a combination of different measuring for the 'after' and standing differently for the 'after'

    What they don't have is any evidence that their treatments work in the long-term- they are only interested in publishing comfort stats to lure people into their costly treatment program.
    Excellent points, Burdle. Not all curves in that range progress. My one daughter got to that range and higher and had 6 month periods of no progression.

    I seriously doubt they did the treatment as much as advertised so I don't believe any result was due to the chiro. They don't report any attempt to find out the compliance rate of the girls and it appears they just believed them if they said they did it every day, three times a day, for two years. LOL.

    The other thing is they say they didn't do the chiro for two years but the girls may have been doing other PT treatments. The one girl appears to be just standing differently. I think they may have told her to stand as straight as possible in the after photo.

    The credibility of these chiros is near zero so I tend to question everything. Chiro is not a science.
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

  7. #7
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    If anyone has any time please take a look at Scoliosis Warriors on Facebook. The is the mouthpiece for Scolismart and they continually post stuff like this.

    Facebook is rapidly replacing the old forums for Scoliosis support- certainly SSO in UK is much quieter now than a few years ago.

    You get banned if you challenge too much- I have several times ( different guises) but honestly I feel we should do our best to try to stop their misleading claims.

    So many parents and young people are being lured to do their costly treatment and they are encouraged by claims such as this one.

    The trouble is we never hear from any one for whom the program has failed and we only hear the short term results anyway.

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    I agree so much money is wasted on lay treatments like chiro. It is adding financial insult to physical injury. Reprehensible.

    The fact that they ban people for correct criticism says it all. That is not the mark of an intellectually honest group. This is not science and it shows.
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pooka1 View Post
    Pubmed checks nothing. They only list articles.
    Yes doubt them. Most published articles in the medical literature and other literatures are probably false.
    Then, regardless in what we believe, we are all in trouble.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pooka1 View Post
    It would imply any improvement was not likely related to the treatment. Recall we are talking chiro here. Chiro is not a science and is based on an imaginary concept.
    Chiropractic like Yoga or Qigong is a ancient practice from thousands of years ago, to not coming from science not necessary imply to be useless. Anyway Clear inventions seems to not have much to do with traditional Chiropractic. The traction chair I remember is based over the concept of a wrong posture image, vanished with the vibration.. yes, is difficult to believe it can reduce an adult curve.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pooka1 View Post
    They are claiming both these girls did treatment at home three times a day for TWO YEARS. I am skeptical they did all that treatment at home.
    They sells the chair.. Clear inventions have sense, but yes, not enough and it should to be known other cases. I have read about Face groups with a lot of people with name and photos, personal history, friends.. saying about good outcomes and showing x-rays.. who knows.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pooka1 View Post
    It remains to be seen if any PT treatment will last a lifetime.
    It would not be logic to wait without doing nothing up to see that.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by flerc View Post
    Chiropractic like Yoga or Qigong is a ancient practice from thousands of years ago,
    "Chiropractic was founded in 1895 by Daniel David (D.D.) Palmer in Davenport, Iowa. Palmer, a magnetic healer, hypothesized that manual manipulation of the spine could cure disease.[201]"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiropractic

    He was a nut obviously.
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

  11. #11
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    It existed it first in Tibet and some Indian tribes as the Incas.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by flerc View Post
    It existed it first in Tibet and some Indian tribes as the Incas.
    How can that possibly be?

    What is the evidence that Palmer didn't invent it in 1895?

    Are you saying it was invented SIMULTANEOUSLY in South America AND Asia and Palmer just copied it?
    Last edited by Pooka1; 01-11-2016 at 10:24 PM.
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

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    He could reinvented the same or something similar. Why not?

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    The CLEAR institute is based on chiropractic- it is a few chiros who have decided to specialise in Scoliosis - probably because with an aging world population they saw a gap in the market from which to make money.

    Scolismart is an offshoot from CLEAR - it appears that they fell out with CLEAR over the traction chair - yet they seemingly they still support their other methods.

    They are all chiros- but chiropractic itself has changed over the years from those who believe all disease originates from spinal misalignment and those who just specialise in pain relief etc. CLEAR and SColismart belong to the latter - except now they are moving in Scolisos territory claiming that they can prevent progression and reduce curves.

    @ Flerc- it is the Facebook sites that worry me the most. As soon as you get misinformed people with scoliosis posting about their marvellous results we have problems. I believe the people are genuine - just that they are not really knowledgeable about their own condition ( again a gap in the market). Scolismart get hold of them- set up a fancy exercise program and give them an Activity Suit ( piece of nonsense no better than a corset) and tell them how much their curve is reduced. We do not even know if the prople were in pain- they were just frightened witless about having a curve in the first place and are now being told it is reducing but only if they keep up the exercise program.

    Scolismart and CLEAR cannot lose- if the curve fails to progress (as it might well have have anyway) they claim success. If the curve does progress they claim that the exercises were not done properly. Job Done...

    I mind most that they are now moving into adult territory- again because of the wide scope of scoliosis - taking adults with degenerative curves and claiming success. They simply don't understand any difference between degenerative adult scoliosis and Adult IDIOPATHIC scoliosis.

    But the worst thing about them is that they are cosying up to some scoliosis surgeons who do VBT.

    I think VBT is great - anything that helps without having to have full fusion has got to be BUT Scolismart pretend that for the cases that do not work that they are keeping the spine flexible to enable them to be candidates for VBT. This is palpable nonsense- if VBT needs a flexible spine then it will depend on age and ordinary exercise - not on Scolismart. But again it is a win for the chiros- they get the money.

    I truly believe that we need a better way for the treatment of Scoliosis- I just wish it was coming from within the medical profession - led by physiotherapists maybe and not from chriropractic.
    Last edited by burdle; 01-12-2016 at 06:13 AM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by flerc View Post
    He could reinvented the same or something similar. Why not?
    Yes he could have but there isn't the thinnest shred of evidence he did. Where did you get the idea that chiro was invented in Tibet and the Inca Empire????
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

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