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Thread: The Dynamic Remodeling method (DR method)

  1. #16
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    Just only to give a more scientist justification of the mind power.. my niece is studying Psychology and said me she read about an experiment did with a sentenced to death
    They said him that he might bleed to death if he want. He accepted and he saw how a cut was done in his wrist. After some minutes, he died.. he didn’t know that the cut was insignificant and he loose so few blood.

    If it’s so extreme used in a negative way, which might be the limit used in a positive way?
    I have heard about treatments to vanish the conscious of disease from mind.

  2. #17
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    The Placebo effect is very real. They have done studies to prove it. It doesn't mean that the people taking sugar pills are hypochondriacs, it means that they are so convinced in their mind that the "medicine" will help or hurt that they react to it in either a positive or a negative way. That's why drug companies always have to have a placebo group to see what the side effects are in this group as compared to the "real" side effects of the drugs. The mind is more powerful than we can imagine. But that is why some of these "alternative" methods may work for some people. They are not crazy, they may just have very strong mind over matter abilities. On the other hand, these same "alternative" methods are usually not proven to work scientifically because of the placebo effect that some may have and relate success, when in fact it comes from within themselves.

    I think that people here are looking for hard, cold, facts of well documented, scientifically accurate procedures that work with whomever it is performed on. Unfortunately, that is very hard to do. I think that the DR method sounds a little better than bracing alone. It addresses specific chest deformity along with curve deformity and the use of a dynamic brace that seems more rigid than a SpineCor, and implements it all with exercise. It will just take time to see how successful this method is.

  3. #18
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    Yes, placebo effect is a proof of a positive effect. In some multicausal problems, improving sufficiently the factor corresponding to one cause, may solve the problem even if all the other causes remains in the same state. Certainly this is what fusion does. An extreme rigidity of the vertebral bodies is enough to maintain the spine straight (regardless the negative effect).

    If we could maximize in the same way some issue of the ligaments or the muscles fascias.. surely at least in many cases that seems to not have solution, the curve could also be reduced in a permanent way. And probably the same might occur if we might does an extreme good use of our mind power.. who knows.

    Unfortunately in hard and complex multicausal problems, is difficult to completely maximize all or even some of the factors corresponding to the causes of the problem, so the only that can be done is improving in the way that we can, all of those factors.. and mind power is one of them.

    The negative of part of the placebo effect is that when because ignorance the effect of a method that works can not be understood, is catalogued as placebo and the real reason is never known.

    Certainly DR is one of the few methods I know trying to remodeling the rib cage.. I'm not sure at all if ABR does it.. but if it can, it does it in a very different way, as is expanding his content..
    Unfortunately many people has not time to wait until evidence with a particular non surgical method is formally demonstrated.. nobody else in the world are giving them any hope.

  4. #19
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    I don't think that the DR method incorporates the placebo effect. I think that the placebo effect is pretty well understood. It can have positive or negative consequences. If one BELIEVES something will happen as a result of a "medication" or a "procedure", then often it does, whether good or bad. It is the power of the mind, which we already know. What we don't know is how to tap into that power all of the time for good consequences. Some people promote forms of meditation and hypnosis for this, but these aren't proven to help straighten spines. At the very best, these might help pain in certain vulnerable individuals. However, these forms of "therapy" involve emptying the mind, something that I'm just not going to do personally. I'm one that likes to stick to proven things. I will admit, that I very skeptically tried accupuncture. I gave it two treatments for a particular problematic muscle spasm that I was having and it worked! I must say, in all defense of that particular treatment, that they used the needles with electrical stimulation, like a TENS unit, only directly into the muscle tissue itself. I credit that with the muscle resease. The whole meridian theory, I believe, is a bunch of hockey since there are no structures or nerve pathways that can actually PROVE the meridian diagram, as far as I have seen. But because of the way that electrical stimulation was used in particular places, the procedure worked.

  5. #20
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    Yes, sure DR has nothing to do with power mind, much treatments that works as homeophaty are considered a placebo by some people because they cannot understand how works, but it could not be the case of DR or other methods that works in some scoliosis cases.. spontaneous improvements is the name given in such cases.

    Some people have a natural control of their mind power. My father have smoked for more than 40 years close to 50 cigarretes per day and some day (around 30 years ago) he began to say to everyone that in 3 months he would not smoke any more and so he did. He was not decreasing the quantity of cigarretes.. until the last day he smoked close to 50 cigarretes and 0 since the next. He said me that in this lapse he made an auto 'psicology programing'. He never read any book about control mind or self-help books..actualy he detests all having to do with psicology, new age or religions. It seems he borned with some concepts incorporated.

    Optimistic people, happy without a clear reason for that.. having faith that all will be fine and not necessary because beliving in some religion, seems to have an unconcious control mind. Sure that practicing some techniques as the belonging to Raja Yoga works and not have a negative side as I believe hypnosis have.
    I don't know if accupuncture may have a western explanation but I know by own experiences that others eastern methods not. The Chi is a not understandable concept for a western mind http://www.scoliosis.org/forum/showt...Yoga-(Tao-Yin) .. I'm not sure if it is not what is activated by power mind..

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by flerc View Post
    Yes, sure DR has nothing to do with power mind, much treatments that works as homeophaty are considered a placebo by some people because they cannot understand how works,
    Homeopathy is known to work as a placebo. How it works is NOT unknown. It has been tested for non-placebo effects and nobody has been able to claim the $1 million paranormal challenge prize.

    How it is claimed to work (water molecules retaining memory only of a certain substance and not all other substances it has contacted) is ruled out scientifically. It's not just that scientists don't know. The serial dilutions remove the substance that was added and the homeopathy types admit this. They just go on to claim (on no evidence whatsoever) that the water molecules retain the memory of the substance. These people do not sit at the big science table but at the kiddie table of irrational nonsense.
    Sharon, mother of identical twin girls with scoliosis

    No island of sanity.

    Question: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
    Answer: Medicine


    "We are all African."

  7. #22
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    I’m only just one case among surely thousands or millions in all the world knowing about evidence that homeopathy works. My son was always sick, when laryngitis ended, otitis, pharyngitis.. began again. Always cold, always with flu, always close to sinusitis.. I believe he didn’t grow as it was expected because the amount of meds he consumed in those years. An allergist doctor recommended a traumatic treatment of injections during years, that fortunately we refused.
    An homeopath Dr. said us that allergies are solved in an almost magic way with homeopathy and she was right. After a week of treatment he was so normal in that sense as every other kid of his age. And he was a to little kid to believe in placebo effect.
    Probably homeopaths may not explain why it works, I don’t know but it works anyway. Germany is not a stupid folk.
    People trying to adapt the reality to their own paradigms are extremely myopic and irrational.

  8. #23
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    A comment about growth hormone. It can help with bone density and potentially muscle mass (although this is sort of debatable) for people who have low levels of GH. It has not been proven to be a safe and effective treatment to be given to people with normal levels.

    As far as 'growth' of bone is concerned. If GH did stimulate bone growth in adults it would be only for increasing density and not height. Once the growth plates are closed, that type of 'growth' machinery is gone. Bones, in theory and somewhat in practice, can be remodeled. But the key is steady and constant pressure. This is why orthodontic braces (and other related products) are so effective. They provide the appropriate load for an extended period of time. I would imagine if the spine were as easy to get to as our teeth, scoliosis wouldn't be as much of a problem as it is.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin_Mc View Post
    A comment about growth hormone. It can help with bone density and potentially muscle mass (although this is sort of debatable) for people who have low levels of GH. It has not been proven to be a safe and effective treatment to be given to people with normal levels.

    As far as 'growth' of bone is concerned. If GH did stimulate bone growth in adults it would be only for increasing density and not height. Once the growth plates are closed, that type of 'growth' machinery is gone. Bones, in theory and somewhat in practice, can be remodeled. But the key is steady and constant pressure. This is why orthodontic braces (and other related products) are so effective. They provide the appropriate load for an extended period of time. I would imagine if the spine were as easy to get to as our teeth, scoliosis wouldn't be as much of a problem as it is.
    Kevin,
    As you can tell, I wasn't quite sure how GH would work on an adult. Thank you for the clarification. As far as orthodontia goes, I was told that the appliance could only be used when my daughter was still small and growing. As I mentioned, she was seven when she got the appliance and wore it for two years. It was successful. But had we waited until she was like 12, she would have had to have teeth pulled.

    Yes, the problem with the spine is that there is no really "good" way to reshape it during growth. It is deep in the body and the structure of each vertebrae would have to be taken into consideration. That is definitely much more complicated. Another HUGE problem, in my opinion at least, is determining actual age of onset. That is a near impossibility. Like I have mentioned on other threads, how many AIS kids are really undiagnosed JIS kids? And for some purposes, it doesn't really matter because once a child reaches adolescence, it seems that brace efficacy goes down. It's catching these kids when it starts. If there were better ways to do that, then maybe a lot of these treatments would be more effective against progression in many children (not all, of course).

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by rohrer01 View Post
    Kevin,
    As far as orthodontia goes, I was told that the appliance could only be used when my daughter was still small and growing. As I mentioned, she was seven when she got the appliance and wore it for two years. It was successful. But had we waited until she was like 12, she would have had to have teeth pulled.
    There are similar products that would obviously use the same principle. Invisalign is one of them. Essentially these are removable braces but are meant to be worn full time except for eating (I'd imagine). And perhaps a product like this would have limitations of which I am unaware.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin_Mc View Post
    Bones, in theory and somewhat in practice, can be remodeled. But the key is steady and constant pressure.
    Kevin, would be possible to estimate how much time of steady and constant pressure is needed in an adult?

  12. #27
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    Flerc,
    I know you addressed Kevin, but it takes years in adult orthodontic cases. And where are you going to put the pressure? Braces put pressure on the structures around the spine, so how are you going to get around this without hurting a person? There is another thread where the mom has her child in a brace and the child is developing a nodule on the rib as a result of the brace. I just don't know how you can get to the spine itself to exert any pressure on it in a positive way.

  13. #28
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    It seems reasonable to believe that would takes years.. but how many with the spine?
    Braces does that kind of pressure because are holding the spine and all that is being holding for it, but I believe it should not to be the only way to hold a spine straight. Anyway if the spine is straight while is stand up, the vertical and horizontal forces would have a different distribution, direction and magnitude... even if someone with a flexible spine, while lying down on the floor (and then with the spine straight) and the feet over the wall receives a high force over the shoulders the effect should to be the same. I believe that other way should be using the inclined plane. http://www.scoliosis.org/forum/showt...exercise/page7 post #99.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by flerc View Post
    Kevin, would be possible to estimate how much time of steady and constant pressure is needed in an adult?
    I'm pretty sure it would be possible to calculate that. The trick would be knowing the rate of bone turnover. This can be extremely variable. As well, the pressure has to be applied to the bone. If you try to apply pressure to the bone VIA soft tissue, I'm not sure how successful it would be. The spine is curved but you'd need to put pressure on individual vertebrae. And the pressure would most likely need to be distraction in order to correct the wedging on the concave side.

  15. #30
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    But that would put a stretch and release force on the spine, not put pressure on it. To put pressure, one would have to carry around weights, which wouldn't be good for the curve. The braces put forces on the ribs, muscles and pelvis but not on the spine itself, as far as I know.

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