Is surgery a gamble?

[CHRIS WBS]

Dr. Lenke told me that I would be able to do anything except gymnastics.

Easy for him to say…he hasn’t had a total spine fusion. I wish surgeons would not tell that to their adult patients. Let’s get real. There are limitations following this surgery. Several years ago I was learning ballroom dancing. I can’t do that anymore as it involves good balance and twisting and bending capability. I doubt that someone who’s an avid tennis player can resume that activity without some compromise. I think in time you will know what you can and cannot do and with some modification be able to return to a sport you love. But to expect a fused spine to perform like one that is fully flexible is unrealistic and I think it’s only fair that a surgeon advises his patients so.

[Doodles]

Chris--I think you are being honest and realistic about this. At least at this point of being out a year plus, there's a lot in my old exercises that I don't think I can ever do again. I've tried to do pilates/yoga type things and I just can't. Trying to sit on floor with legs out is impossible because unless I support myself with my arms behind me I fall backwards. My PT didn't think that could change and wasn't too optimistic that I would get much flexibility back from here on out. I'm glad I wasn't into all the sports things some are--but I miss not being able to do some of the exercise classes which my body needs or I just puff up! I do other exercises/walking/etc. etc. everyday but they don't seem as good as the old ones. I don't know it could be since I'm in the older range; some seem to do such amazing things I just can't believe it! Janet

[leahdragonfly]

Why not swimming??

Back-out,

You mentioned that you think you will have to give up swimming...Why couldn't you swim after you were healed?

I swim laps 5 days a week for about an hour, and my surgeon said I can go back to the pool after a few weeks and start to walk in the water, then slowly resume swimming. I don't know if I'll still be able to do flip turns though (maybe I will later, just not sure), but other than that, I plan to return to swimming.

Karen,

I think this is a really great thread and I have many if not all of the same concerns as you. I just scheduled my surgery for October 11th, T10-pelvis. I worry too about what my new back will feel like, and what I will do if I hate it at first (nothing much to do about that obviously, other than adapt). But, I look forward to having a much more stable spine that will not progress or degenerate any further (in the fused area anyway). I am an active mother of two young kids and several pets, so I will have to get back to speed as soon as possible to keep up with all of them.

Good luck,

[Back-out]

Back-out,

You mentioned that you think you will have to give up swimming...Why couldn't you swim after you were healed?

I swim laps 5 days a week for about an hour, and my surgeon said I can go back to the pool after a few weeks and start to walk in the water, then slowly resume swimming. I don't know if I'll still be able to do flip turns though (maybe I will later, just not sure), but other than that, I plan to return to swimming.

I was referring to before I'm completely healed, Leah! And it's the bending and twisting I'm concerned about as that's indispensable to my sloppy freestyle. I must confess I'm a bit concerned about collisions in the lanes too. I remember they always used to occur "in the olden days when I was active"

Especially since one is blinded by the water and can't wear a brace to warn people off, I don't see how it's avoidable. Even after fusion is complete, seems that would be a problem, no?

Mind you, I'm not crazy about swimming, either - at least, in a pool. It turns my hair green and takes SO much more time out of my day. All that showering, shampooing and hair drying, plus driving there and changing - which will undoubted to take longer (wriggling into a suit, with a long fusion MUST be harder) . It WOULD be nice to have a pool, of my own of course!

Also, I want something weight bearing to ward off osteoporosis. Even Olympic swimmers have been shown to lose bone density because of the buoyancy of the water.

But many thanks for your comments. I should have made my context clearer.

[joyfull]

I've read these posts with great interest, even though it's 1:05 AM and I have to work tomorrow! You all have made such good points. I am having my surgery in 5 days with Dr. Lonner.

I have waited 30 years to do this. As I have posted before, I don't have, and have never had, any pain. I'm doing this to stabilize my 85-90 degree thoracic curve and hopefully improve my chances of having a good quality of life later on. My posture is good and most people don't notice my curve since I wear loose clothing. This is a really, really hard move - a leap of faith in my surgeon, actually. Plus, my two sons, ages 26 and 20, don't really get why I'm doing this and I feel as if I'm causing them great anxiety and stress. I am going through a difficult divorce after a 38 year marriage and my sons have no contact with their father, so they feel especially threatened by my decision right now. I do have some guilt about it.

My curve is pretty rigid, so I'm wondering if I will even notice the difference in the T2 to L4 fusion.

Your stories have given me the courage to go through with this and to assure my sons that I will be OK. The impact you all have had on so many lives is amazing. Thank you again, Joy

[Back-out]

Plus, my two sons, ages 26 and 20, don't really get why I'm doing this and I feel as if I'm causing them great anxiety and stress.

I'm very interested in this comment as I have two sons, 21 and 30 and I'm wondering what is reasonable to ask of them, in help and support (I'm quite alone).

I'd love to know your approach to this. Of course, I'm realizing your situation is very different as my son's father and I have been divorced forever. Your sons OTOH must be afraid they're going to lose their only real, ie, remaining parent!

Funny, how kids can see something like this as being about them instead of you. But then when it comes to a marriage unravelling (and especially to Mom) in my experience, kids just don't realize that Mom/Mommy whatever is NOT invincible and has serious needs of her own.

Maybe to hand feed them specially chosen encouraging literature about successful outcomes, plus stories about women who neglected their curves (and became completely disabled ) - would help them see they were getting something out of it too Namely, a mother who will be stronger and healthier - and more able to be there for them long into the future. And without "being a burden" on them!

They need to know that you will be there no matter how old they are, especially when going through this trauma. You don't say if they had much relationship with their dad before the divorce, but they must be going through a great deal now. Doesn't help that they're guys and "not allowed" to talk about their pain and fears.

Poor "kids". And poor Mom. If I were you I"d feel an almost equal mixture of compassion for their pain, and anger that they weren't thinking of my needs.

(And that's more or less where it' s at with me, though they're so different from each other, I can't really generalize.)

Best of luck. You're going through so much. I hope you can get over the guilt feelings though it goes with Momship. You really deserve this. It's their FATHER who sounds to be screwing them over. Why oh why do Moms always get blamed and even blame themselves for everything - even taking time for themselves, in this courageous, difficult way?

I can scarcely imagine not realizing that - but then emotions aren't rational, by definition*. I'll put in my usual plug for a few meetings with a good family counselor - it's my training, and I think everyone can benefit. I sure hope you have a great support system apart from your sons. I HATE having to ask mine for help, knowing it stresses them badly.

Best! Amanda

* But then I put off "emergency" neurosurgery for two years while one son in crisis needed me!

[LynetteG]

Wow Joy - I didn't realize you're only five days away from surgery. You'll do great and you'll be happy you did this. You're in my thoughts and prayers, and your sons will be happy for you when they see their mom with a new strong back and great posture.

[loves to skate]

Chris--I think you are being honest and realistic about this. At least at this point of being out a year plus, there's a lot in my old exercises that I don't think I can ever do again. I've tried to do pilates/yoga type things and I just can't. Trying to sit on floor with legs out is impossible because unless I support myself with my arms behind me I fall backwards. My PT didn't think that could change and wasn't too optimistic that I would get much flexibility back from here on out. I'm glad I wasn't into all the sports things some are--but I miss not being able to do some of the exercise classes which my body needs or I just puff up! I do other exercises/walking/etc. etc. everyday but they don't seem as good as the old ones. I don't know it could be since I'm in the older range; some seem to do such amazing things I just can't believe it! Janet

Janet, Did your Physical Therapist teach you how to stretch your ham strings? I would think that would help you be able to sit on the floor unsupported. Just guessing. Sally

[Doodles]

Sally--Yes, he did as a matter of fact. He said it's OK to go ahead and do those (which I do) but he said even if I did this for hours on end he thinks the pay off for more flexibility would be almost nothing. He's still blown away by my x-rays. Can other people sit on the floor with legs spread and not fall over backwards that are fused to pelvis? I try it a couple times a week thinking I'd tighten up abs. I told pt that and he said the abs weren't the problem, it was just all that was fused. I used to do this all the time with lots of stretches. I could never bend over flat on the floor like pilates classes told you to but I could do quite a bit. I'm having a bad four weeks here. Everything on the left side hurts. First it was neck and shoulder for a week, then 2 weeks plus of hip & leg and to ankle. This morning leg was slightly better and it was back in the shoulder and neck. Every motion hurts. I can't figure this out. If it continues thru weekend I think I'll call the surgeon locally who has seen me twice since surgery. Janet

[JenniferG]

"Can other people sit on the floor with legs spread and not fall over backwards that are fused to pelvis?"

I'd never tried that but just did it to see if I could. Getting down to the floor is very hard for me, I have to hold onto something and lower myself down or do it on my knees then roll over - all very awkward. But I can sit on the floor with legs apart and not fall over. It's very uncomfortable and I lean to the left, but I can do it. It's just not something I've needed to do so far, so hopefully I never will again!

I'm sorry to read you're having troubles Janet, I must read back and see what it is.

[lapieper]

Just plunked myself on the floor, and yes, I can sit on the floor with both legs stretched out. I do NOT fall over backwards or forwards. And I had my first back surgery Apr 08. Most recent was Dec 09, where the lower portions of my rods and the pelvic screws were removed. I am currently doing water aerobics, an hour daily, five days a week, and I just started walking 1.5 miles a day on my treadmill (30 minute walk). I am thrilled with the results, although I do still have muscle spasms. I have not taken any muscle relaxers in the last 2-3 weeks. I am now able to ride on the motorcycle for about an hour before I need a break, and we have ridden about 600 miles in a weekend. Looks like I'll be on a road trip for our vacation this year. FINALLY. Life is a risk, and the surgery did not firghten me. Went in with a posiitive attitude, figureing it was my "job" to heal, and the doctor's job to do it right! Good luck to all those facing surgery soon.

[LynetteG]

Wow - I just tried to sit on the floor, and I couldn't flatten my legs on the floor, they are sooo stiff. I need to start stretching my hamstrings. I kept on falling backwards as a result.

[loves to skate]

I can sit on the floor with my legs stretched in front of me open or closed without falling over, but it is not really comfortable for me. I never could bend enough at the hips to really bend flat to the floor. It must have something to do with the structure of the hip joints. I never could do a back bend as a child either, or a split, so was never very flexible. I have to stretch my hamstrings every day to maintain what flexibility I have.

Lynette, you are still early on in healing to start stretching your hamstrings. Wait until you are cleared by your Doctor.

Sally

[golfnut]

Janet,
I'm sorry to hear your having pain issues more than a year after surgery. I hope it improves and you find out what has caused it. I am lucky that I live close to Dr. Lenke's office in case I run into problems.

[Doodles]

You guys are so great. Didn't expect you all to try it! Jennifer, I know what you mean about getting down on the floor! Sounds like this is something different for everyone too. Lynette, be careful--you're way too early for this, I think. I have had a better day today. Now if I can recreate it! Thanks, all. Janet