bending to pick things up

[theizzard]

I am 3 months from surgery and as soon as my back felt able, i started bending to pick things up. I emailed my doctor's assistant to find out if it was ok to do this and what weight was acceptable to pick up at 3 months as opposed to when I left the hospital. Also, since I have started bending down to pick things up and to feed the cats, my hips both of which are replaced and have been very good to me are starting to hurt in some positions. I imagine as I am asking this I shouldn't bend at all but once I was able to do it I started to do it especially if out without a gripper. How bad do you think this is?
avis

[debbei]

I am 3 months from surgery and as soon as my back felt able, i started bending to pick things up. I emailed my doctor's assistant to find out if it was ok to do this and what weight was acceptable to pick up at 3 months as opposed to when I left the hospital. Also, since I have started bending down to pick things up and to feed the cats, my hips both of which are replaced and have been very good to me are starting to hurt in some positions. I imagine as I am asking this I shouldn't bend at all but once I was able to do it I started to do it especially if out without a gripper. How bad do you think this is?
avis

Hi Avis,

Sounds like you're doing better! When I saw the Dr. for my 4.5 month checkup, he told me that I could bend. He didn't give me a weight limit, but said only to lift what feels comfortable. I try not to 'overdo' bending, just now and then. And of course I still squat a lot, for instance to feed the dog. I always use my grabber for laundry, because I figure why should I wear out my disks picking up 5 people's clothes off the floor?? No way. I love that grabber.

Another funny thing I do is use my 'built-in' grabber. LOL--I'm constantly picking things up with my toes, and bringing my foot up to my hand to give me the item I pick up. YOu'd think I was a monkey. I was always good with my feet (my younger sister used to tease me that I could write with my toes) but this is a whole new level.

[theizzard]

I have been using my feet as "built in grabbers" all my life. It's nice to meet a
fellow "monkey."
avis

[always smilin']

There's probably more of us monkeys out there than we realize:)

[chello_ns]

I'm a monkey too!
Did you get an email reply back from your doctor regarding your email?
I'm almost three months post op and able to bend (with doctor's approval). When I saw my doctor a week and a half ago I asked him about any restrictions and he lifted a bunch of mine but everyone's body is so different! Although I can bend I still squat rather than bend most of the time or leave what I dropped for my hubby to pick up (hehehe). Just because I'm doing well I'm not going to risk overdoing it!

[SIsForSarah]

Another monkey here! Picking things up with my toes has been the norm for me since I hernated my L5/S1 about a year and a half ago. Those grabbers are also great - I have three strategically located around my house.

A note to those recently fused: While getting to finally bend down and pick things up may be exciting, it's probably worth doing in moderation. I've been fused from T5 to L2 since 1990 and have herniated my L5/S1 (one of the only "good" 4 discs below my fusion) twice in the last 10 years. It's really worth being very careful to preserve those last discs, because I have a hunch they herniate more easily with the fusion above them. Having said that though, when I last went to a back specialist, I was told I have no more disc degeneration than the average person my age.

[debbei]

It's really worth being very careful to preserve those last discs, because I have a hunch they herniate more easily with the fusion above them.

That's exactly my thought and why I continue to use my 2 grabbers and my monkey feet as much as possible! Why bend for no good reason? :)

[JanL]

Bending at 3 months! That amazes me. My doctor told me not to bend for a year. Then, at my one year checkup he said, "ok, now don't bend for another year!" Maybe that's because I am fused all the way to the sacrum.

[S4Sarah]

You should not be picking up anything heavy. From what I heard like the first 6 months you can't pick up anything near 20 pounds or heavier, now different cases have different restrictions and time requirements for the restrictions. You really should talk with your doctor about this and even if they say it is okay to bend over it does not sound like a good idea to be picking up anything heavy or even moderatley heavy.

[andyluw]

We must be twins! My first surgery was February 12 and second was March 26 and I have been bending and not using my grabber as well. I also have been rethinking this as I have developed pain in my right side where I used to have herniated disks in the L5-SI. My surgeon said that everyone heals differently and that at this stage it is too early to tell if there are issues as long as the x-rays look good. NSAIDS are helping me to reduce the inflammation, and I'm sure you can guess the next step-BE CAREFUL! We feel so much better from the life that we became accustomed to, and tend to try and take the recovery to fast because we feel better than we have in a long time. It's time to remember to bend from the knees (great exercise for the behind) and/or use your grabber. It's easy to feel that we should be doing more than we are because of the improvement in our pain levels, but the reality is that we are still in the beginning of our recoveries. Remind your family and friends that it time to take a step backwards and take some stress off of your back. By the way, I am fused from the T9-SI and am filling the dog's food and water dishes. Can't use the grabber for this so I try to remember to have someone help or else fill extra full and sit on a chair to place them on the floor. I'm glad to know that I am not the only one in this position. My hubby and three kids got too used to me trying to jump into cleaning that I have no business doing, and after listening to their reasoning and my body, I'm ready to comply and I hope you will too. Good luck and hope to hear things go well for you!

[theizzard]

It jumped out at me that you use NSAIDS to reduce inflammation because my surgeon was most emphatic about not using them because they will negatively impact the fusion that we want to occur. A fusion needs the inflammation and doesn't do well if the inflammation is reduced. Does your doctor know you take NSAIDS? By the way, I started bending because of problems I had when using my grabber to pick up the cat dishes. More times than i care to say when using the grabber to put down nice fresh food, the dish would flip and fall perfectly upside down with the food on the floor. Using 2 grabbers with paper towels I was able to clean the mess up but it got so annoying that when my body felt able, I began to bend. I must say though I cannot bend at all first thing in the morning so I use the grabbers then. My decrepit arthritic body can barely walk so forget about bending and I don't use my inner monkey to pick up cat food bowls. Yuck!
avis

[asccbodypro]

Theizzard,

Glad that someone mentioned bending...and yes I am a fellow monkey as well lol! I am about 5 weeks out now. I was upstairs today by myself and needed toilet paper that was stored on the floor in the bathroom closet. Rather than going to get the grabber or a helper, I got a roll out by using my feet yet just could not get it with my feet so I squated down...very straightly...and picked it up. I didn't feel any discomfort in my back at all and also had my brace on:O) but man oh man my left leg was weak as hell getting up and it hurt just a tiny bit. I am hoping that I won't be paying for this one later. Any opinions out there on bending down at this stage of the game. It certainly isn't something I plan on doing again anytime soon but just wondering if it was a "BAD" thing to do this soon after surgery. Keep in mind I didn't bend the back:O) Guess time will tell throughout the day!

[Singer]

I was told to not bend from the waist AT ALL for a year. At my first year check-up, I was told to bend over from the hips and I said, "Wait -- I'm allowed to do that!?" and it felt okay. I still use my grabber all the time...I can't imagine doing a load of laundry without it.

However, I'm at the point now where I will bend a little without thinking, such as when I'm making the bed..and it's okay. I still don't bend much though.

I was very confused about waist-bending vs. hip-bending for a while and I made my surgeon demonstrate the difference. Someone described hip-bending as bending like a toy soldier and that's exactly right -- you keep your thoracic spine straight while pitching forward. Waist bending is what I do if I'm feeding the cat....such as when I'm already squatting but I need to reach forward as well. I usually make my husband or daughter do it....:cool:

[asccbodypro]

lol...good idea making the doctor demonstrate. I did neither of those bending methods. I more of less bent at the knees and kept everything straight as could be:O) I think I will be ok, I just felt the weekness in my legs vs. anywhere else. thanks, I just wanted to check. It gets a little confusioning sometimes as to what you can and cannot do...I will definitely asks for demonstrations.....should be worth a good laugh.:D

[JenniferG]

Confusing is right. I only know what I should and shouldn't be doing from reading this forum because I was given no instructions. But I do bend, as a combination of bending at the hips and squatting at the same time. I haven't got a grabber so also use my toes a bit, especially with the laundry.

I had to mop up cat vomit on my bedroom carpet the other day, that was done on hands and knees. No problem but getting up is tricky!

[LynnMarie74]

Well, its nice to see we are all kind of in the same boat. A rocky,unstable boat! lol I too question if Im "bending" too much or in the wrong place. My doc also didnt give me "specific do's and dont do's" He said do what feels comfortable and stop when it feels wrong. I know what he means...its like trying to bend your elbow the opposite way. It just wont go! I use a combo of squating & waist bending...and was cleared of all my restrictions as my 3 month post op visit. I was not given a spec. weight restriction either...like Debbe....but was told to start slow. I guess all we can do is trust our bodies and instincts...oh...and keep using our "inner monkey" for help! lol That was cute. I think we all have developed good toe muscles and tricks! :)
My husband laughs at me sometimes when he sees me doing that....instead of asking if I need help, apparently he gets his kicks from watching! lol

[theizzard]

I have two methods of cleaning up cat vomit. First I pretend I don't see it and let my husband "discover" it and the second is using 2 grabbers and wads of paper towels and playing a sort of cat vomit hockey in moving the vomit from the floor to the paper towel, then folding it and getting it in the trash without the paper towel falling apart and dumping the vomit in a new place. Then you have to soak clean paper towels with water and using your longest and best grabber work at the carpet or the floor whichever they have vomited on. I have also been able to clean the cat litter with a similar paper towel and grabber technique. Someone mentioned hands and knees to clean the vomit which certainly works but it is so hard to get up from the floor.
avis

[debbei]

I pretend I don't see it and let my husband "discover" it

Avis,

That is my preferred method of disposing of dog puke! :)

[txmarinemom]

I try not to 'overdo' bending, just now and then. And of course I still squat a lot, for instance to feed the dog. I always use my grabber for laundry, because I figure why should I wear out my disks picking up 5 people's clothes off the floor?? No way. I love that grabber.

Another funny thing I do is use my 'built-in' grabber. LOL--I'm constantly picking things up with my toes, and bringing my foot up to my hand to give me the item I pick up.

LMAO, Debbe ... I used my toes a LOT too, and with a fusion ending at L1 (for me), it was easy to do. It's a little more difficult to do laundry with your toes post of - if you're so inclined (LOL) - and I used my Gopher grabber for that for months. I'm STILL finding uses for the replacement of my original, purchased before surgery!

These days - at almost 16 months post-op (where does the time go???) - I still also squat for things vs. hunching over: It results in a lot less tightness/discomfort than repetitive bending. When I garden (I have this huge container thing going in my back yard), I sit or squat close to the task - even when I'm watering.

That said, I was cleared of almost all restrictions at 3-4 months. The only thing I was barred from was playing softball, playing golf (although I was free to do the cages and range), and deep sea fishing. I was allowed to surf/wade fish at 3-4 months out. Something, I'm sure, related to fighting a huge fish - pulling up - from 80-100' down.

All docs are different, and all fusions are different. I was back on the ballfield *sliding* at 7 months post-op, but that doesn't mean it's the right thing for everyone.

Neither does it mean it's the WRONG thing for everyone :).

Regards,
Pam

[theizzard]

my main problem with bending is my knees. I can't squat because it is too painful and even after the cortisteroid (spelling?) shots, which help somewhat, it is just not something I can do for more than a few seconds. I do a sort of wide leg bend which gets me closer to the ground and the wider apart my legs are, the closer I can get. Unfortunately, the inner monkey cannot be used for everything especially cooking. That is unless you can hold a pot holder in your feet and then you can at least take things out of the oven with the inner monkey.
avis

[loves to skate]

Hi Avis,

My knees bother me also if I squat. Dr. Rand told me that I shouldn't squat as it is very hard on the knees. If you go down on one knee, it is much easier on the knees and it is also easier to get up. I had pretty much figured that out for myself soon after my surgery since I was not able to squat at all and if I mistakenly did squat :(, then I couldn't get up without help.

Take care, Sally

[asccbodypro]

[QUOTE=theizzard;77591]It jumped out at me that you use NSAIDS to reduce inflammation because my surgeon was most emphatic about not using them because they will negatively impact the fusion that we want to occur. A fusion needs the inflammation and doesn't do well if the inflammation is reduced. Does your doctor know you take NSAIDS....

I am curious about this because my Dr. hasme on celebrex which if I am correct is for inflamation. I will have to ask about this next week! It's seems as though there is always something to think about!

[titaniumed]

Susan

Never a dull moment. Go easy on the Celebrex......

http://www.modernmedicine.com/modernmedicine/Modern+Medicine+Now/NSAID-Use-Inhibits-Post-Surgery-Spine-Fusion/ArticleNewsFeed/Article/detail/597563

Ed

[asccbodypro]

Ed,

Yes, I have been thinking about this all afternoon and wondering why my Doc has me on it. As I said, I go in next week, Tuesday to be exact. This is going to be my first question!

How are you feeling theses days? Are you Feeling better than you were a few weeks back? I feel like I have missed things since my surgery. Still trying to catch up!

Take care.

[52skeedoo]

Dear one and all...

I've been laughing aloud and just plain loving this discussion! Thanks to everyone who has contriubed. It's so nice to hear about the ways people have adjusted to life post-fusion !

I also have bad knees so I'll be among those doubly-challenged, but the several of you who share this issue have given me hope. I believe I too will succeed. Kitty vomit and dog poop be d....d !

Question: when did you return to routine housecleaning such as sweeping, mopping, vacuuming?

I'm thinking just now about my dishwasher. There's no way I can put dishes in it without bending. (my poor husband -- I can see it now -- Sorry, honey, but I just can't do the dishes any more :D)

Only 4 weeks more weeks until my own version of this fun begins.

Sheri

[theizzard]

Sheri, you might want to be careful about how you talk about loading the dishwasher. After all, you might end up at the sink washing dishes by hand, which requires no bending at all. I don't use my dishwasher anymore so I always do it by hand. Right after your surgery, believe me you won't be washing dishes by hand or in the dishwasher. and if I were you, I wouldn't be racing towards vacuuming, sweeping or mopping. Those things can all wait while your back is healing.
avis

[titaniumed]

Susan
Positive or negative nsaid reports vary on who did them and at what time. All we know is that there have been lawsuits in the past due to people having clots and heart attacks. That is proof enough. Safe as milk. LOL

And in talking about milk, I actually drink the stuff! Low fat of course! Sounds dangerous doesn't it? Hope the milk promoters don't get mad at me.

Thanks for inquiring about my health. That's a topic that's been quite a challenge for me. The stones scare the hell out of me, for sure. The back is fine and dandy at the same time. I've been fine, and I've been dandy, but only after my surgery have I been fine and dandy at the same time. I really should send this status report to my surgeon, so he can have the full understanding needed for recovery. LOL

At 6 weeks out you should be approaching or seeing fine. You will have to wait for the dandy part as it takes a few months. Walking, proper diet with protein, getting off meds, proper sleep, all contribute to the healing process.

Sheri
I remember the dishwasher right after my surgery. I would get over it and with a slight lean and I would drop my dishes down and also my silverware. That worked well. For unloading, I would have to squat, then one by one, lift the dishes up on the countertop.

Forget about cleaning for a while after surgery. Just forget about it. Any arm sweeping motions with force, will be tests and will make you extremely tired and send you back to bed right away. This goes on for a few months. Yes, these duties will need to be transferred to the luckiest of lucky.

Avis
Its funny how we all want to see what we can get away with. I remember bending over every once in a while, and would think to myself, I'm not fused yet, better not push it. We all need to take it easy for quite a while after scoli surgery. Now at 16 months post, I do dumb things every once in a while like shovel 5000# of landscaping rock. I went from 5# to 5000#.

Pam
Banned from deep sea fishing, I'm not surprised. Down in Cabo, they have the 1000# club. These are the guys who have hooked the huge marlin weighing 1000# plus after the fight. They have weight loss calculations based on fight time. A fish of this caliber will lose approx 200# in 24 hours, and some of the 1500 pounders can fight for 40 hours and drag 50foot fishing boats backwards 50 miles through choppy seas.

I can attribute about 5 degrees of cobb progression to a 70# tuna that smoked me a few years ago. He smoked me, then I paid to smoke him.LOL I was using 40# test so it took 3 hours. I came to the conclusion that salt water fishing was too much work and diving is so much easier. I still have to wait to dive since I'm 30 days out from my gall bladder removal. In the dive books,its 90 days min after surgery.

Ed

[Qikdraw]

And in talking about milk, I actually drink the stuff! Low fat of course! Sounds dangerous doesn't it? Hope the milk promoters don't get mad at me.


Well as long as you only drink the rGBH free stuff. Giving cows steriods to produce more milk just doesn't sit well with me. Nor actually with most industrialised countries who have outlawed it in their milk...

I actually like Silk as a substitute.

[loves to skate]

Sheri,
I started unloading the dishwasher by pulling a chair over to the dishwasher and putting the dishes on the counter. My husband had to put the dishes away but at least, I felt like I was contributing.
By the way, forget the sweeping, dusting and vacuuming for awhile. Your house won't mind a bit. Right now we have a lot of pollen in the air, so I won't bother to clean my house until the pollen is done. First the oak pollen, then the pine pollen. It lasts over 4 weeks so that's my excuse and I'm sticking with it. Take good care of yourself. Sally

[txmarinemom]

Pam
Banned from deep sea fishing, I'm not surprised. Down in Cabo, they have the 1000# club. These are the guys who have hooked the huge marlin weighing 1000# plus after the fight. They have weight loss calculations based on fight time. A fish of this caliber will lose approx 200# in 24 hours, and some of the 1500 pounders can fight for 40 hours and drag 50foot fishing boats backwards 50 miles through choppy seas.

I can attribute about 5 degrees of cobb progression to a 70# tuna that smoked me a few years ago. He smoked me, then I paid to smoke him.LOL I was using 40# test so it took 3 hours. I came to the conclusion that salt water fishing was too much work and diving is so much easier. I still have to wait to dive since I'm 30 days out from my gall bladder removal. In the dive books,its 90 days min after surgery.

You better take care of your empty lil' gall bladder holder, Ed. If the dive books say 90 days, I'd trust them more ...

I'm no longer banned from deep sea fishing: That restriction was lifted at 7 months. Does it mean I could have given a diving Amberjack a run for his money at 7 months? Nah. I'd have handed the pole to someone in < 10 minutes. I'm in a LOT different shape than I was 8 months ago ... and I'd probably still hand it over if I hooked 1000 lbs. of marlin - LOL!

Do I think I'll EVER win a battle of wills teasing in a 1000 lb. marlin, even using heavy tackle? Negative. There just isn't that much of me, and I don't care *what* lb. test I'm using ...

I just LOVE saltwater fishing. Luckily, I'm just as happy in the shallows and flats, hooking a 40 lb. black drum off the rocks (they sink like a refrigerator), or wearing out a running bull red from the pier.

There's something about being offshore, though ... and I was SO glad it wasn't a permanent restriction. In fact, I don't HAVE any permanent restrictions. Sky diving will be my next big "neyh-neyh" to fusion surgery ;-).

(I'm also currently working to do a backbend again - LOL. I'll keep you updated on that!)

[andyluw]

It jumped out at me that you use NSAIDS to reduce inflammation because my surgeon was most emphatic about not using them because they will negatively impact the fusion that we want to occur. A fusion needs the inflammation and doesn't do well if the inflammation is reduced. Does your doctor know you take NSAIDS? avis \
My surgeon has left my medications to my family practitioner and/or pain management doc. My family practitioner, who has all info on my surgery, is the one prescribing me the NSAIDS. I was taking ibuprofen, but he now has me on Mobic. Since my last post, I have developed occasionally-severe pain and swelling in my knees and was diagnosed with osteoarthritis in both knees. So much for those squats! I am very upset that nobody had mentioned that taking NSAIDS could impact my fusion! I am so glad that you brought this to my attention-I just hope that being four months postop, this has not negatively affected my healing and fusion. I am going to call my surgeon's office as soon as they are in and see if anyone has some info for me. The hospital had a presurgery class you had to attend and they emphasized repeatedly to smokers and nonsmokers alike the hazzards of smoking, but not once did anyone mention NSAID use! Now I'm worried. I drink my lactaid-free milk, take calcium, magnesium, cut down my iron (I've been anemic since I was a teen and had to be transfused after first surgery), but was it all for nothing?

[debbei]

\
My surgeon has left my medications to my family practitioner and/or pain management doc. My family practitioner, who has all info on my surgery, is the one prescribing me the NSAIDS. I was taking ibuprofen, but he now has me on Mobic. Since my last post, I have developed occasionally-severe pain and swelling in my knees and was diagnosed with osteoarthritis in both knees. So much for those squats! I am very upset that nobody had mentioned that taking NSAIDS could impact my fusion! I am so glad that you brought this to my attention-I just hope that being four months postop, this has not negatively affected my healing and fusion. I am going to call my surgeon's office as soon as they are in and see if anyone has some info for me. The hospital had a presurgery class you had to attend and they emphasized repeatedly to smokers and nonsmokers alike the hazzards of smoking, but not once did anyone mention NSAID use! Now I'm worried. I drink my lactaid-free milk, take calcium, magnesium, cut down my iron (I've been anemic since I was a teen and had to be transfused after first surgery), but was it all for nothing?


My surgeon gave me permission to take ibuprophen occasionally (at my 5 month appt), but I'm not going to touch it for at least one year. The nurse practitioner told me that for short fusions, it's ok to take earlier, but I'm 13 levels and I should avoid for at least one year.

[jrnyc]

all this bending and lifting has me puzzled and confused...i am still debating surgery but finally figured out levels, because the epidural i just had covered more upper area but less lower area of my back than the actual surgery will. at least i think so....

the actual surgery will concentrate on my lower back, and leave the upper to botox shots....

have "right thoracic curve of 40 degrees"(probably no surgery) and "a left lumbar curve of 60 degrees" (surgery)
surgery recommended "combined anterior and posterior fusion with the anterior interbody fusions done L4to the sacrum, and then followed by posterior instrumented fusion from T 11-S 1 with bilateral fixation..."

does this make sense to anyone?? i dont understand how far up my back the rods willstart, but know they will go ALL THE WAY DOWN my back...it is the DOWN part that scares me....

how i would be able to bend after that LOWER surgery puzzles me, but i am sure some of you guys are dealing with it...?

any advice deeply appreciated, as these epidurals are just a temporary fix....and i know it...

thanks to everyone:)

[JenniferG]

I am fused from T4 - pelvis and the way I bend now is from the hips, whereas once it would have been from the waist. Does this help explain it? Someone described it as like a tin soldier. A combination of bending at the hips and bending at the knees seems to cover most situations, though not all (yet) for me.

With rods like mine, it's impossible to bend at the waist. It's a bit like trying to get your elbow to bend backwards...it can't be done.

I guess we're all different but I can't say I've felt much of a loss in losing the ability to bend at the waist. The prospect of a healthier old age is more important to me.

Good luck!

Jen

[LynnMarie74]

(I'm also currently working to do a backbend again - LOL. I'll keep you updated on that!)



Oh Pam.....you scare me, but that's so cool....good for you. Im scared to do some of my PT moves still....but I guess 5 months out -vs- 16 months out is a big difference. I just continue to feel like Im gunna snap a rod! :p

[jrnyc]

dear jennifer
congratulations on completing surgery and continuing to heal....i wish you the best..

i am seeking info from anyone w/both anterior & posterior fusion w/fixation, as that is what i will require..most of surgery involves lower lumbar...that is why it scares me, as it will be both front & back...
is there anyone out there with this kind of an experience?

any response most appreciated! :confused:
jess