Degenerative Disc Disease

[farokie]

I've been visiting this site for some time, and never seen any mention of DDD along with the scoliosis. My first scoliosis specialist visit is scheduled for next week. Two MRIs done 3 years apart have identified the scoliosis and 4 "dessicated" disc (originally only 2 disc). Do these two problems run hand in hand, or are they two seperate conditions? Sure this is probably a stupid question, but I've just always "assumed" the two were commonly connected to one another and have never questioned the physicians.

[Karen Ocker]

Yes, the discs involved get compressed in an abnormal manner. It happens sooner in scoliosis than with persons with straight backs.

[Theresa]

I was told I have severe scoliosis with osteoarthritis of the spine with DDD when they were doing x-rays a few months before my surgery.

[farokie]

I always thought, it just made sense for DDD to rear its ugly head with the scoliosis.......but, I'd never seen it mentioned. Thanks ladies for the reply.

Theresa,
I'm not familiar with the procedures you mentioned. Were they able to repair/replace your disc? Were you experiencing much hip/leg pain? My appointment is 4/17 and I'm getting anxious.

[Theresa]

Are you questioning what an osteotomy is? That is where they go in and cut a wedge piece of bone out of the spine and then pulling the spine back together it pulls you into a straighter position. Click here (http://spineuniverse.com/displayarticle.php/article858.html) to see some diagrams of ostetomies.

I have not been able to stand completely straight since my first scoli surgery in 2004 which in turns causes horrible back pain. I am now getting ready to go back for my third surgery for the same problem plus hip and leg pain.

[farokie]

Thanks for the link, that explains alot. So sorry to hear that you are having so much pain. I pray that your upcoming surgery will do the trick for you. Have you tried swimming? I'm no athelete......but, something about the water really helps me(mostly mental I'm sure). The pool is the only place that I'm near pain-free. Best of luck to you!!!

[Theresa]

Being in a warm pool really feels good. I have had a few long sessions of PT in the pool. I was going about three times a week for a couple of months. This past summer I started swimming. Swimming is not all that easy for me anymore. When I do the freestyle or the breast stroke it puts too much stress on my lumbar spine. I think it is connected somehow to my back not being positioned right.

[farokie]

Totally understand.........sometimes my strokes are a little on the "creative" side and my turns at the end of the lap are pretty ugly.......but the water feels so good and hopefully, nobody is videoing the event. All that said, there are times when swimming just isn't possible (usually because of muscle spasms). I am glad you mentioned the PT......there is a class at the YMCA that might be worth checking out.

Well, best of luck to you, and please let us know how the surgery goes.

[briarrose]

I have 2 degenerative discs. One at the top and one at the base of my curve. My doctor said it was from aging (I was 24 at the time!!!). It only makes sense that it is from the scoliosis since there is more pressure on those discs than on the other ones.

[farokie]

I have been confused about the lack of discussion on DDD. All doctors that I have seen so far (first specialist visit is today :eek: ), have cautioned me about allowing ANY surgery. One back dr. saying "you will start a domino effect that cannot be stopped". He went on to tell me that any disc repair would place additional strain/pressure on the adjacent disc, forcing me to have more and more repair work done. At the same time, I see alot of surgical success stories, that seem to have lasted for many years. This propmpted me to wonder.....Doesn't every scoliosis patient have disc damage, and if so, why are they not experiencing these problems. I know that each situation is unique, but hopefully, the dr. visit today can clear up some of my questions.

At 24, I can't imagine a dr. having the nerve to tell you that the problem was age related..........I'm 52, probably too old to treat.

[Theresa]

This is just me guessing out loud, but once you are fused your spine doesn't move anymore. I also thought I had read somewhere that since your spine doesn't move anymore your discs harden up from lack of lubrication. Just like my doctor told me that even though I have arthritis all over my spine it shouldn't be bothering me anymore cause there is no movement going on. I not sure how correct any of that is but I believe due to the fusion you don't have the problems with DDD anymore except the disc at the top and bottom of the fusion.

[farokie]

Theresa,
Well......saw my specialist, so all of my questions have been answered. More questions will surely come up after I've had time to "process" the info. I am now left with only one more question for you.........In the Perfect World, where hindsight is 20/20, how do you feel about the results of your surgery? If you could go back to pre-op, would you do it again? I don't mean to put you on the spot, but would really appreciate your thoughts.....

[holygirl111]

I dont know how old you are but I am 42 and have both. I was just diagnosed with the Degenerative Disc Disease and I have had severe scoliosis since I was 12. I am now having alot of complications from both. I am also in alot of pain and full of arthritis. I am going next week for epidural pain management to put off any surgury but yes having both is tough, the only thing that got me this far is that I used to be an aerobic instuctor and kept my joints moving . I just hope my pain managment works

[Karen Ocker]

I dont know how old you are but I am 42 and have both. I was just diagnosed with the Degenerative Disc Disease and I have had severe scoliosis since I was 12. I am now having alot of complications from both. I am also in alot of pain and full of arthritis. I am going next week for epidural pain management to put off any surgury holygirl111

I personally wished I had done it sooner both as a child when a cruder method of surgery (no rods were used) was performed and when I lost that correction as an adult requiring a re-do.

Why?

1)Because the larger the curve the more damage to the spine and discs.
2)The larger the curves the less correction which can be obtained.
3)The larger the curves the more risk involved and technically difficult for the surgeon
4) A longer recovery is required.
5) A person with severe curves becomes more easily deconditioned and presents for surgery in less optimal physical health; coming sooner would have been easier on the patient.
6)Progressing curves in adult life continue to progress forever regardless whether the pain is masked by medication.
7) We become miserable and it affects our friends and loved ones-who could not possibly understand our situation.
8)We become unable to work with resultant financial impact.
9)Life is passing by and we only go this way once.
10) All the above is mostly avoidable and can be remedied with the correct surgical technique.

Every single person with scoliosis is terrified of surgery; if hanging up-side down from poles, physical therapy, exercise, chiropractic, and wishful thinking would straighten our spines permanently we all would have done that long ago.

I had revision surgery at age 60(2002). I am working, pain free and planning on hiking in the Alps in June. I regret having to live with that deformity so long.

[wnorm]

I am a 54 year old menopausal female with an untreated curve of 45 degrees living in Montreal. I am presently on a one year waiting list to see Dr. Ouellet. My orthopedic surgeon moved to the States a few years back after informing me that I would probably need surgery in about 5 to 10 years. I am in "scoliosis limbo". I suffer from degenerative disc problems and am in almost constant pain. I had a cervical herniation last year. Does anyone know if scoliosis promotes ddd and herniation. My orthopedic problems read like a grocery list. Would surgery create unnecessary pain and suffering? Any educated opinions out there?

[Theresa]

Farokie,

I didn't see your last question there until just now....Sorry! Yes, I would go down the same path and do it all over again. The only thing is.......it would have been alot sooner!!!! We were always told there wasn't anything the doctors could do. Now remember, I'm an Air Force Brat, and when they discovered my scoliosis at 12 or 13 we were living in Japan. When it was checked again we were living in Germany. If you read Karen's response to holygirl111 alot of that applies to me as well. My spine, ribs, muscles, nerve roots and anything else that is in there is so messed up from the scoliosis. I truly believe that is why I'm having such a hard time. Like my doctor said at one time, my body is rebelling against and resisting the corrections done to it after being all bent for so long.

[CHRIS WBS]

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not look back and say you wish you had done this sooner. I started to think that way and then told myself to not even go there. I truly believe that events happen in our lives when they are meant to. Being one of four children, I was the sibling who never moved away from home. Consequently, I was left with the responsibility of looking after my parents as they had to deal with some serious illnesses. Over the past 20 years I’ve had to be there for my mom as she fought a 10-yr. battle with cancer. After she died, my dad fell ill. I was the one who was there while he underwent major heart surgery, a stroke and eventual nursing home confinement because Alzheimer’s disease claimed him a victim. For three years until his death I was going back and forth to the nursing home several times a week to be with my dad. When I look back, there is no way I could have done what I did if I had been laid up recovering from back surgery; and I believe God spared me from the pain associated with progressive scoliosis all that time so I could fulfill those obligations. And now at age 58 and only within the past two years having experienced worsening effects, I’ve turned this over to God and truly believe that if surgery is part of His plan for me then He will surely open a window for me and provide me with the help that I will need; and if not, then that too is His plan for me and I have to accept it.

Chris

[Karen Ocker]

Chris:
I was also the family caretaker. When I had my revision at age 60 Mom was 85 living alone and walker dependent. When I had the surgery my siblings HAD to step up to the plate and they did. Fortunately I am now able to help her at 90.

Yes, Chris, maybe there is no point in wishing I had done it sooner. On the other hand I firmly believe my experience benefitting others is God's plan for me -especially when it spares other unnecessary pain.

[CHRIS WBS]

I couldn’t agree with you more, Karen. I believe you are exactly where you are meant to be and doing God’s work. God wants us to be of service to others, and you and Linda have been a tremendous service to those seeking answers and looking for guidance. You will never know in this life how many people have benefited from your caring and support. Keep up the good work.

Chris