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susancook
04-18-2012, 03:04 AM
I have a 36 degree thoracic lumbar scoliois s curve and my pain management MD suggested 2 medial branch blocks with lidocaine and then if I had 80% or more relief of pain from that, then he could do a denervation. Anyone had experienve w/ this? My pain is mostly a buring R sided pain and pain over the spine. I am in an "8-9" pain in the evening, most evenings. Any help in assisting me to understnad this would be helpful Thanks.

rohrer01
04-18-2012, 03:22 AM
First of all, WELCOME!

I am a fellow pain sufferer with relatively small curves also. I have not had denervation, which I'm guessing is the same as nerve ablation? What levels are you having pain and where specifically is your pain?

jrnyc
04-18-2012, 02:48 PM
i have had nerve ablation...didn't do much for my severe lumbar pain, though...
but that is not to say it wouldn't help you....
the nerves grow back anyway....

jess

susancook
04-19-2012, 12:48 AM
First of all, WELCOME!

I am a fellow pain sufferer with relatively small curves also. I have not had denervation, which I'm guessing is the same as nerve ablation? What levels are you having pain and where specifically is your pain?

Everyone on this forum is so good at knowing exactly what level everything is....my pain is in the right side, the concave side of the curse about my bra level. Guess I should get an anatomy book and figure it out. According to my xray, I have "severe degenerative disc disease" from T10 to L5 and "moderate disease" from L5 to S1.

susancook
04-19-2012, 12:51 AM
i have had nerve ablation...didn't do much for my severe lumbar pain, though...
but that is not to say it wouldn't help you....
the nerves grow back anyway....

jess

Thanks for your response. I do understand that it is a temporary fix....if at all, but I would love some pain relief, even temporarily!

Pooka1
04-19-2012, 06:44 AM
According to my xray, I have "severe degenerative disc disease" from T10 to L5 and "moderate disease" from L5 to S1.

DDD is said to be like death and taxes... inevitable if you live long enough. The vast majority of adults end up in a doctor's office for back pain at some point in their life, maybe mostly due to this.

The question is if you have more advanced DDD for your age due to scoliosis. And then the question is what treatments will help. Only a surgeon would know.

My father-in-law has debilitating pain issues which I assume are DDD but he is 72. He has no scoliosis.

Good luck.

susancook
04-21-2012, 02:43 AM
First of all, WELCOME!

I am a fellow pain sufferer with relatively small curves also. I have not had denervation, which I'm guessing is the same as nerve ablation? What levels are you having pain and where specifically is your pain?

Thanks! My pain is in the thoracic area mostly on the R side. I have pain over my spine and lateral to the spine. It is generally a burning kind of pain. I also have sciatic pain on the Right side.

rohrer01
04-21-2012, 05:29 PM
Treatment for the DDD may solve your pain problems. Did you have the scoliosis or the DDD first? I know that many people w/out scoliosis develop DDD, But I also wonder if those with scoliosis develop it faster. My DDD was "mild" as of two years ago, yet still caused a significant amount of sciatic and back pain. I also have suspected sponlylolysis. I haven't had the proper test to confirm it, as there's not much that can be done about it anyway. I have no vertebral shifting on x-ray. But DDD along with arthritis can be very painful, even in the mild stages. So it's not surprising to me that you are in so much pain. I hope your procedures work. My last epidural steroid injection worked for about a year before symptoms started coming back. It's definitely worth a shot (no pun intended!).

susancook
04-22-2012, 02:00 AM
Treatment for the DDD may solve your pain problems. Did you have the scoliosis or the DDD first? I know that many people w/out scoliosis develop DDD, But I also wonder if those with scoliosis develop it faster. My DDD was "mild" as of two years ago, yet still caused a significant amount of sciatic and back pain. I also have suspected sponlylolysis. I haven't had the proper test to confirm it, as there's not much that can be done about it anyway. I have no vertebral shifting on x-ray. But DDD along with arthritis can be very painful, even in the mild stages. So it's not surprising to me that you are in so much pain. I hope your procedures work. My last epidural steroid injection worked for about a year before symptoms started coming back. It's definitely worth a shot (no pun intended!).

Thanks for you vote of confidence. I see the pain managment MD this week, so I'll set it up. Apparently I have to have 2 blocks that are successful before they do a "Radiofrequency Neurotomy". So hard to figure out what causes the pain? Scoliosis, DDD, arthritis,....If the Neurotomy solved my problem, that would be awesome and so much easier than scoliosis surgery, huh? Then I guess that I just "follow the curve" and have xrays done to check the progression of the curve. I'm going to ask the scoliosis surgeon whate he does for the DDD in the surgery when I see him this week, a busy week! I have "severe" DDD from T10- L5 and "moderate" DDD from L5 to S1. Can't help the situation much, huh?.
Susan

jrnyc
04-22-2012, 03:15 AM
a friend in CA had arthroscopic surgery for DDD...he is fine now, though he does not have scoli....
it was nothing compared to fusion surgery, per his report...

most pain management treatments are a world away from scoli surgery...
most are simple in comparison, easily done in a doctor's office...
get up and walk away afterwards....then hope whatever it was... worked....
people have reported all kinds of results after such treatments, from no relief, short term relief,
to longer term relief....
most report no complications, which is nice for any tx....

jess

susancook
04-23-2012, 01:55 AM
a friend in CA had arthroscopic surgery for DDD...he is fine now, though he does not have scoli....
it was nothing compared to fusion surgery, per his report...

most pain management treatments are a world away from scoli surgery...
most are simple in comparison, easily done in a doctor's office...
get up and walk away afterwards....then hope whatever it was... worked....
people have reported all kinds of results after such treatments, from no relief, short term relief,
to longer term relief....
most report no complications, which is nice for any tx....

jess

Thanks for your response. It is hard to sort out just what is causing my pain? the scoliosis? DDD? arthritis? other fracturing of little old lady back? anyway, the discs can't be helping any and that is a question that I have for Dr. Hart is for him to estimate what is causing my pain of all of the possible etiologies. Then, if I do [and that is a big, big distant] have the scoliosis surgery, what will he do for the discs? I will ask him about "quick office fixes" for discs that he might be able to do, but when I have asked him about minimal surgery in the past, he has assured me that it was not appropriate for my back. I'll see what he says.

jrnyc
04-23-2012, 10:29 AM
i do not believe there are any "quick office fixes" for bad discs...
or for any spinal pain or injuries for that matter....

when discs are first injured, many doctors give high dose prednisone, then wean
the pills down...i found that doesn't help much...it helps with the pain initially, but then
you have to go off the prednisone, and the disc pain is back...
any in office pain treatment is temporary, addresses the pain, doesn't fix the discs themselves....
my CA friend who had arthroscopic disc surgery had 6 weeks of recovery, after which
he was fine....but as i mentioned, he does not have scoli...

bad discs can cause really awful pain, and the pain can go on for a long time...
i have also found that disc injury can reactivate with any new stress on spine...
my husband has a good back, but he hurt his discs, and his back hurts all over again any time
he does anything stressful to his spine...

in office treatments are fast compared to scoli surgery....compared to any major surgery....
but they are not able to fix the problem itself...the steroids address the pain coming from the problem...
and steroids carry their own risks, as i discovered with my cortisol problem....

for many years, the theory was that "scoliosis doesn't hurt"...doesn't cause pain...
that theory is STILL subscribed to by many doctors...


jess

rohrer01
04-23-2012, 12:24 PM
Susan,
It's also my understanding that they treat adult onset degenerative scoliosis much differently than those of us with unknown etiology (IS - idiopathic scoliosis). I don't think the trigger in degrees for surgery is the same. They want our curvatures to be much higher. So I don't know what the criteria are for fusing with progressive degenerative scoliosis. You'll have to ask your doctor about that one. I hope you can get some pain relief in the meantime.

Rohrer01

susancook
04-24-2012, 02:01 AM
Susan,
It's also my understanding that they treat adult onset degenerative scoliosis much differently than those of us with unknown etiology (IS - idiopathic scoliosis). I don't think the trigger in degrees for surgery is the same. They want our curvatures to be much higher. So I don't know what the criteria are for fusing with progressive degenerative scoliosis. You'll have to ask your doctor about that one. I hope you can get some pain relief in the meantime.

Rohrer01

Thanks for your response. You are right that the curve numbers are not necessarily what triggers surgery. Dr. Hart said criteria for me would be: pain, increasing curve [think he said 5* in one year], compromise of GI or lungs, loss of function, but mostly pain. I'll let everyone know about the diagnostic medial branch blocks and then the Radiofrequency neurotomy. These procedures are supposed to deaden the nerves that supply the facet joints. The denervation has the advantage of treating pain and avoiding or delaying surgery. The treatment only lasts from a couple of weeks to maybe year or a little more, but any kind of relief would be welcomed. I'm looking for new ways to deal with pain. I'm not in enough pain to consider fusion surgery, but am pretty miserable, especially in the evening. Analgesics don't seem to work and I think that the PT has helped as much as it is going to help....bummer. But, I will continue to do my exercises. The stretching of my back feels good and does break the monotony of the pain.
Susan

titaniumed
04-24-2012, 11:39 PM
Hi Susan

I just wanted to say welcome...

I went as long as I could and had pretty bad lumbar DDD and 4 herniations with sciatica. This can also lead to end plate damage....a good question for Dr Hart.

I did not do any shots. It was offered....but at the end with my x-rays looking pretty bad it just didnít make sense to me. I was barely walking and pain was spiking 10. Death and taxes, and my tax was due. I was a Luque wire candidate in 1976 so it was a long wait.

I did just about everything else, Chiro, massage, and hot water soaks. Hot water is the easiest way to get the most relief from extreme pain events.

I do have a stretching machine......and an arch table. Electrostim machine, sock installer, walker, ski poles, and scuba gear! All used for scoliosis.....Just PM me if you are interested. The stretching machine is a professional unit that was ordered by a doctor for me, and its heavy duty and weighs a few hundred pounds...not an easy thing to move, but can be done. Anything is possible, Iíve proven that.

Ed

susancook
04-26-2012, 04:18 AM
Now that everyone has provided some info, I went back to the pain managment MD at OHSU who had me bend backwards right and left and forwards and slow him where my pain was, and he said that he didn't think that a Radiofrequency Neurotomy would be helpful, and that I should consider the scoliosis fusion offered by the surgeon for pain relief. At which point, I did what any mature 65 YO woman who had all of her hopes on a pain relieving procedure does, I started crying. I was so bummed. So then he upped my pain meds, which I don't want more systemic sedation and gave me a presciption for Gabapentin. I left his office crying and forgot to make a follow-up appointment. There has to be some other pain relieving procedures that I can have on my back short of a T3 to S1 fusion for pain relief! Before I saw the current pain management MD, I had a thoracic lidocaine injection. That was 4 month ago. It worked for 24 hours but it was amazing for the 24 hours, I was back to the old me. Thanks for taking the time to read this....I'm just bummed......
Susan

rohrer01
04-26-2012, 02:57 PM
I know what it's like to be bummed. I've had doctors tell me contradictory stuff so much that I don't know what to believe any more. The last two visits to my spine doc I left crying. So 43 y/olds do it, too. I hope you can find some peace in what ever decision you make.

Best Wishes,
Rohrer01

susancook
04-27-2012, 02:47 AM
I know what it's like to be bummed. I've had doctors tell me contradictory stuff so much that I don't know what to believe any more. The last two visits to my spine doc I left crying. So 43 y/olds do it, too. I hope you can find some peace in what ever decision you make.

Best Wishes,
Rohrer01

Thanks for your support. I also saw the surgeon this week. He said that I was a "good candidate for surgery" and to call him when if I decide to have surgery. I have decided to stick my head in the sand for 9 months barring loss of function or a great increase in pain and then have another set of xrays done in Jan 2013. I'm at peace with that decision and have made plans to go off to Fiji for 2 months Sept-Nov 2012 to do women's health teaching. I think that I can control the pain OK. I can't live on the fence of should I have surgery or not, so making the decision to wait at least until next spring feels right. It's a balancing act: Dr. Hart [the surgeon] said that in his experience at one year after surgery, 80-85% of the patients have decreased pain, 10-15% have the same pain, and 5% have more pain. For the amount of pain that I have right now, I don't feel that I want to risk having a big surgery that will impose great post surgical limitations for the possible risk of 20% being the same or worse.

I don't know where the well of tears came from, yes, I do, they came from the lack of control that I have over this whole pain and scoliosis process. Inspite of doing everything that I am told to do, I still hurt alot at the end of the day. So many other things in life I could control by going to more school, working harder or spending more money but this one doesn't seem to listen to me and that's where the tears come from, I think anyway. I just wish that Dr. Sibell [the pain management MD] could have offered me some alternative other than more sedating drugs. I sent him a post visit email that I was disappointed that the neurotomy procedure was not a option and that I hoped that we could revisit that in the future [or other procedures, non-medications] and he said that was an option. Maybe just getting my hopes up again.....Thanks again for your response. Great to know that there is someone out there listening or reading and someone else who melted into tears under pressure.

Susan

jrnyc
04-28-2012, 12:45 AM
how many pain management guys have you consulted with....???
are you willing to try another one....?
i have had pain doctors tell me they are not so sure a procedure will help me, but since
it is in office, if i am willing to try it and the insurance approves it, they will go ahead for me...
i have had it happen more than once, with more than one pain doctor....
sometimes the procedure helped for a few weeks, sometimes not at all....
i never regretted trying any of the procedures...i was desperate...
and none were worse than surgeries i have had in my lifetime...not spinal, but other kinds...
all were tolerable within a doctor's office...to me, no big deal....
i always appreciated the doctors' willingness to give me a chance....

jess

rohrer01
04-28-2012, 01:13 AM
Thanks for your support. I also saw the surgeon this week. He said that I was a "good candidate for surgery" and to call him when if I decide to have surgery. I have decided to stick my head in the sand for 9 months barring loss of function or a great increase in pain and then have another set of xrays done in Jan 2013. I'm at peace with that decision and have made plans to go off to Fiji for 2 months Sept-Nov 2012 to do women's health teaching. I think that I can control the pain OK. I can't live on the fence of should I have surgery or not, so making the decision to wait at least until next spring feels right. It's a balancing act: Dr. Hart [the surgeon] said that in his experience at one year after surgery, 80-85% of the patients have decreased pain, 10-15% have the same pain, and 5% have more pain. For the amount of pain that I have right now, I don't feel that I want to risk having a big surgery that will impose great post surgical limitations for the possible risk of 20% being the same or worse.

I don't know where the well of tears came from, yes, I do, they came from the lack of control that I have over this whole pain and scoliosis process. Inspite of doing everything that I am told to do, I still hurt alot at the end of the day. So many other things in life I could control by going to more school, working harder or spending more money but this one doesn't seem to listen to me and that's where the tears come from, I think anyway. I just wish that Dr. Sibell [the pain management MD] could have offered me some alternative other than more sedating drugs. I sent him a post visit email that I was disappointed that the neurotomy procedure was not a option and that I hoped that we could revisit that in the future [or other procedures, non-medications] and he said that was an option. Maybe just getting my hopes up again.....Thanks again for your response. Great to know that there is someone out there listening or reading and someone else who melted into tears under pressure.

Susan

My last pain doc said I have so much pathology that I will NEVER be off of narcotics and muscle relaxants and that surgery will make me worse. My scoli doc doesn't want me on any meds and says the surgery will make me worse. So where does that leave me? It's very frustrating to say the least. Arghh...

susancook
04-28-2012, 01:19 AM
how many pain management guys have you consulted with....???
are you willing to try another one....?
i have had pain doctors tell me they are not so sure a procedure will help me, but since
it is in office, if i am willing to try it and the insurance approves it, they will go ahead for me...
i have had it happen more than once, with more than one pain doctor....
sometimes the procedure helped for a few weeks, sometimes not at all....
i never regretted trying any of the procedures...i was desperate...
and none were worse than surgeries i have had in my lifetime...not spinal, but other kinds...
all were tolerable within a doctor's office...to me, no big deal....
i always appreciated the doctors' willingness to give me a chance....

jess

This is my third pain management MD and probably the smartest one. He said that my insurance wouldn't pay for it since he couldn't recommend it. I see his point, why take the risk of a procedure if he really doesn't think that it will have a benefit. But then again, my back is so complicated with arthritis, DDD, and scoliosis, that I'm not convinced that it wouldn't help. He recommended "the surgery" which is the big fusion, which is what he thinks will really help me the most. I don't think that my pain level is enough to justify the BIG GUN. So then he offers more pain pills which lead to more sedation, and I don't like that either. He said that we could revisit the procedure possibility again, so we left it there. Thanks for you advice and hopefully with re-examintaion in the future, that procdure or another will seem appropriate for me.
Susan

jrnyc
04-28-2012, 10:48 AM
many scoli patients also have DDD and arthritis, as well as stenosis, listhesis, etc...it is not unusual...
i have never met a pain management doctor in favor of scoli fusion, unless to stop progression...
every pain doctor i have met...and that is several...has advised against the surgery, unless it is
"to stop progression...if you are doing it to address pain, don't do it"
then they tell me about their patients who come to them for pain management AFTER they
had the surgery....
scoli surgeons tell me the exact opposite...they tell me pain management may help for a while, but it
only addresses the symptoms caused by the problems...pain management is not capable of fixing
the problem(s)...to fix the problem(s) requires surgery...

however, no surgeon wanted to operate on me when my curves were smaller...
now that they are 42 and 70, surgeons keep telling me surgery is the only "fix"
but the next thing they say is "i cannot give you any guarantees"
so it makes the decision very difficult...

i am not trying to be negative...only realistic...
surgery is not a guarantee of solving the problem...for some lucky people, it seems
to be right...for others, even with a top scoli surgeon, it is the start of
more surgeries...
it amazes me how different the outcomes can be, even with an excellent experienced doctor....

jess

rohrer01
04-28-2012, 11:47 AM
Jess,
They can NEVER give any guarantees. What I've heard from most of the doctors that seriously talked fusion with me is that 80 - 85% of patients have a reduction in pain. Susan's case is different than ours. Her scoliosis is adult onset scoliosis cause by the degeneration of her spine. This means that her spine is not stable. Our cases, at least mine, the degeneration is caused by the scoliosis. So if the scoliosis is stable, then we can do other things to treat the pain from the degeneration. I hope that made sense. I've never heard of a pain doctor recommending surgery, either. So if one did, then it is probably the right thing to do. Leahdragonfly used Dr. Hart and from what I understand he's pretty good. Susan wouldn't be having the fusion, per se, for the scoliosis. She'd be having if for the other problems with her spine.

Susan,
It's a hard decision to make. I'm not saying which way you should go. I would seriously consider it if your pain OR your curves worsen. Your case is different, as I mentioned to Jess.

Best Wishes,
Rohrer01

jrnyc
04-28-2012, 01:52 PM
i have DDD, scoli, spinal arthritis, listhesis, hypokyphosis, spinal stenosis, etc etc...
every time i see pain doc in Manhattan and bring up surgery, he warns me not to do it for pain....
EVERY time...
only surgeons recommend surgery to me...
i am so hesitant...because IF it doesnt go right, regardless of how good the surgeon is,
all that is left is more surgery....revision....
i read the revision section of forum and it stops me in my tracks...
and my scoli was not diagnosed til i was 31 years old, though i suspect it was there
much earlier...but i cannot prove it...

just a note...i think surgeons will not just do DDD surgery on someone with scoli....they insist
on doing complete fusion....which i think is a shame....i would be willing to just get DDD surgery
in a second...no hesitation...

jess...& Sparky

susancook
04-29-2012, 04:07 AM
At OHSU the Pain Management MD and the surgeon seem to work together. It's not a conspiracy, but they support each other. Yes, the parting note from the pain management MD was "I advise that you strongly consider surgery for your pain". There is not one scoliosis as I am learning. Scoliosis that starts in adolescence or earlier and then progresses into adulthood is a whole DIFFERENT bird than my scoliosis, that of degenerative adult onset scoliosis. Kind of like apples and oranges. How can a MERE 36* curve be so painful for me? Dr. Hart said that he had a patient with adult degenerative scoliosis with a curve smaller than mine who had substantial pain that he had just operated on this week.

Thank you to everyone that responded and thanks for your support. It is comforting to know that I am not alone in this endeavor. My brain is certainly foggy as I said before when he declined to do the procedure, he upped my pain pills and added Gabapentin and life seems foggier now. Pain is the same. Pain is now my new companion in retirement. I am thinking of creative ways to incorporate my new friend into my life. Susan

leahdragonfly
04-29-2012, 10:47 AM
Hi Susan,

I am so sorry to hear that your appt with Dr Sibell was so disappointing. I can't help wondering what changed that he had previously recommended the blocks followed by the denervation, then changed his stance on that. I thought they figured these things out from looking at MRI's, not from having you bend on physical exam. What do you make of that?

I had another opinion several years ago in Eugene from Dr Chris Noonan, who is a spine specialist but not a deformity specialist. He told me I could try some epidural steroid injections but he was doubtful they would help me for any period of time, I think because my spine was unstable and the pain was mostly due to mechanical slippage/instability. As I think I mentioned when we met, I did try two rounds of these injections, at a pain clinic in Eugene which did not impress me at all. I got no relief from these injections, and the second one made things temporarily worse. So perhaps the pain doc recognizes that your problems can't be helped by nerve ablation. I am guessing that you have a lot of these same problems.

Dr Hart will be happy to give you the names of several patients similar to you, so that you can speak to them by phone. I did this and found it very helpful before having surgery. If you call and ask for Robin she can help you with this.

I was offered gabapentin by my primary care doc at one point about two years before my surgery, but I am really sensitive to a lot of drugs, and the descriptions of it made me decide not to take it. I am really sorry that your prescriptions make you feel foggy but with unrelieved pain. That's a crappy combo.

Hang in there...

Karen Ocker
04-29-2012, 12:57 PM
No one in medicine, even for non-scoliosis issues, gives guarantees. That being said, it's always "risk vs likely benefit". My case was one of the most complex I have read about here. So when a doctor says no guarantees that did not, in my case, deter me.

With my medical background, I did not see how living with a collapsing spine would reverse itself in my remaining years. I did not see, how covering up my pathology with pain management would magically make my life better. I did everything possible to keep fit and it did help. Pilates was very helpful and reduced pain. I walked 3 miles at a time but it did not halt my collapsing spine and I saw myself getting worse and worse despite all reasonable alternatives.

Many doctors, who do not have the correct skills, I have noticed, will discourage helpful surgery out of ignorance---claiming "the pain would be worse". Scientifically speaking, straightening the spine-even a little, would relieve pressure on the nerves being crushed by the curve. One jerk did not believe I had actually HAD a successful revision at age 60. He said "scoliosis surgery was never done over age 19"!. This was 7 years ago.

Scoliosis surgery is NOT new. It has been done for over 50 years, successfully, and constantly being perfected.

I have absolutely NO pain after a very complex revision. It was done at age 60 - 9 years ago. I got my life back.

For people who fear revisions: My original, primitive surgery, lasted over 40 years.

jrnyc
04-29-2012, 02:33 PM
my expected benefit from surgery includes a curve reduction to 35 degrees..
so i would be left with a 35 degree lumbar curve AFTER surgery....

it is a tough decision...i hope there is something short of surgery that can help you....
it took me over 5 years to find the sacroiliac joint injections that killed most of my lumbar pain...
temporarily....but now i have a new worry with low cortisol, caused by the steroids...
i know everything short of surgery is temporary...
so i hope, if you have the surgery, that you are one of the 85% of patients who get reduced pain
after healing....
i wish you the best solution that leads you to a life without pain....

jess...& Sparky

susancook
05-09-2012, 04:16 AM
Jess,
They can NEVER give any guarantees. What I've heard from most of the doctors that seriously talked fusion with me is that 80 - 85% of patients have a reduction in pain. Susan's case is different than ours. Her scoliosis is adult onset scoliosis cause by the degeneration of her spine. This means that her spine is not stable. Our cases, at least mine, the degeneration is caused by the scoliosis. So if the scoliosis is stable, then we can do other things to treat the pain from the degeneration. I hope that made sense. I've never heard of a pain doctor recommending surgery, either. So if one did, then it is probably the right thing to do. Leahdragonfly used Dr. Hart and from what I understand he's pretty good. Susan wouldn't be having the fusion, per se, for the scoliosis. She'd be having if for the other problems with her spine.

Susan,
It's a hard decision to make. I'm not saying which way you should go. I would seriously consider it if your pain OR your curves worsen. Your case is different, as I mentioned to Jess.

Best Wishes,
Rohrer01

Thanks for trying to make sure clarity out of a very confusing situation. Right now I am dealing mostly w/ worsening sciatica. The question is should I just have the minimal sciatic problem taken care of, of just do the whole spine. Of course, Dr. Hart said, the whole spine. He does not do the minimally invasive lumbar procedure that is very appealing for me to have done. I'm not hurrying into anything. Thanks for the support. I need it.
Susan

susancook
05-09-2012, 04:19 AM
my expected benefit from surgery includes a curve reduction to 35 degrees..
so i would be left with a 35 degree lumbar curve AFTER surgery....

it is a tough decision...i hope there is something short of surgery that can help you....
it took me over 5 years to find the sacroiliac joint injections that killed most of my lumbar pain...
temporarily....but now i have a new worry with low cortisol, caused by the steroids...
i know everything short of surgery is temporary...
so i hope, if you have the surgery, that you are one of the 85% of patients who get reduced pain
after healing....
i wish you the best solution that leads you to a life without pain....

jess...& Sparky

Thanks for your support.
Susan

rohrer01
05-09-2012, 05:21 PM
My personal opinion is that if you just have the lumbar minimally invasive procedure done, it will put stress on the discs above/below the fusion making that area worse. I believe, and someone correct me if I'm wrong, that messing with short areas of the spine is usually contraindicated when scoliosis is present. Thus, your surgeon's advice to have the larger fusion. It will probably save you from having to have repeat surgeries. I really hope things work out for you.

susancook
05-29-2012, 04:09 AM
Hi Susan,

I am so sorry to hear that your appt with Dr Sibell was so disappointing. I can't help wondering what changed that he had previously recommended the blocks followed by the denervation, then changed his stance on that. I thought they figured these things out from looking at MRI's, not from having you bend on physical exam. What do you make of that?

I had another opinion several years ago in Eugene from Dr Chris Noonan, who is a spine specialist but not a deformity specialist. He told me I could try some epidural steroid injections but he was doubtful they would help me for any period of time, I think because my spine was unstable and the pain was mostly due to mechanical slippage/instability. As I think I mentioned when we met, I did try two rounds of these injections, at a pain clinic in Eugene which did not impress me at all. I got no relief from these injections, and the second one made things temporarily worse. So perhaps the pain doc recognizes that your problems can't be helped by nerve ablation. I am guessing that you have a lot of these same problems.

Dr Hart will be happy to give you the names of several patients similar to you, so that you can speak to them by phone. I did this and found it very helpful before having surgery. If you call and ask for Robin she can help you with this.

I was offered gabapentin by my primary care doc at one point about two years before my surgery, but I am really sensitive to a lot of drugs, and the descriptions of it made me decide not to take it. I am really sorry that your prescriptions make you feel foggy but with unrelieved pain. That's a crappy combo.

Hang in there...

I didn't see your reply before now. I was so angry about not having the procedure that I didn't look at this blog. Well, the increased narcs and the additional Gabapentin was a disaster! I had double vision when driving home late at night [after the 4 PM dose, the second of the day], and almost ran off the road a few times. Sorry to say that happened a few times, so now I am back to my old regime of meds. Dr. Hart did offer me a hookup w/ prev patients then did not follow through, so I sent him an email on Friday to remind him.
Right now I am considering "minimally invasive" lumbar surgery for my sciatic pain. I asked Dr. Hart if he did the procedure and all he wants to do is the whole S curve, so a neurologist in Vancouver is looking at doing the procedure on my, I think L4. Sciatic pain is radiating around to the front of my thigh. Ugggggghhhhhh.
Susan

susancook
05-29-2012, 04:26 AM
My personal opinion is that if you just have the lumbar minimally invasive procedure done, it will put stress on the discs above/below the fusion making that area worse. I believe, and someone correct me if I'm wrong, that messing with short areas of the spine is usually contraindicated when scoliosis is present. Thus, your surgeon's advice to have the larger fusion. It will probably save you from having to have repeat surgeries. I really hope things work out for you.

So confused. I need more information from the minimally invasive procedure MD on exactly what the surgery entails, and then go back to Dr. Hart, the "do the BIG surgery" [he will not be pleased with me, I am sure] and ask his opinion of how he think that the minimal procedure will affect my whole back. Your concept of the "deck of cards" makes sense. Just sounds so appealing to have a surgery that has a very minimal recovery for the area that is giving me [think it's L4] the most pain right now vs. a really BIG T3 to S1 fusion....I think I'll just run away......
Susan

jrnyc
05-29-2012, 06:53 PM
suggest a consult with Dr Anand in LA...
he might do one online if you send him your X rays, etc
his receptionist offered that to me, but i flew out to see
him a few years ago instead...
he claimed all scoli fusion can be done with minimally invasive approach...
also, the danger of above and below the fusion having problems
later on is true regardless of the surgical approach used...
i need a full fusion, so that was not a concern for me...

jess

rohrer01
05-29-2012, 07:45 PM
Susan,
Just an FYI. You only have 5 lumbar vertebrae. There is no L6, unless you are talking about S1. The sacrum is a fused mass of vertebrae and they use the term S1 for the top portion as far as I know. I hope you can get this worked out. It is frustrating when you don't know which option to take. But be glad you have options. I don't have any surgical options right now. I have to go with injections of different sorts. I would take Jess's advice and speak to Dr. Anand if that is possible for you. I believe, since he's worked with minimally invasive procedures and scoliosis for a long time, he'll give you the straight scoop on what "can" be done from his perspective. Then go back and discuss with Dr. Hart the options and see what his opinion is and if he thinks it will work. I wish you all the best.

LindaRacine
05-29-2012, 08:28 PM
Susan,
Just an FYI. You only have 5 lumbar vertebrae. There is no L6, unless you are talking about S1. The sacrum is a fused mass of vertebrae and they use the term S1 for the top portion as far as I know. I hope you can get this worked out. It is frustrating when you don't know which option to take. But be glad you have options. I don't have any surgical options right now. I have to go with injections of different sorts. I would take Jess's advice and speak to Dr. Anand if that is possible for you. I believe, since he's worked with minimally invasive procedures and scoliosis for a long time, he'll give you the straight scoop on what "can" be done from his perspective. Then go back and discuss with Dr. Hart the options and see what his opinion is and if he thinks it will work. I wish you all the best.

Actually, some people have 7 lumbar vertebrae.

Pooka1
05-29-2012, 08:36 PM
Actually, some people have 7 lumbar vertebrae.

Yeah Rohrer. I can't believe you didn't know that!! :-)

susancook
05-30-2012, 02:34 AM
suggest a consult with Dr Anand in LA...
he might do one online if you send him your X rays, etc
his receptionist offered that to me, but i flew out to see
him a few years ago instead...
he claimed all scoli fusion can be done with minimally invasive approach...
also, the danger of above and below the fusion having problems
later on is true regardless of the surgical approach used...
i need a full fusion, so that was not a concern for me...

jess

Opinions, opinions....I asked Dr. Hart whether the minimally invasive appoach would work for me and he has said no twice. So, unsure who to believe. Some of the medical literature that I have read says that the jury is still out on the minimally invasive surgery....again, I just want to run away sometimes..... Thanks for the info though, Susan [and sorry about being so snappy on the other blog. I was trying to be funny and I realize that you don't know me, Sorry]

susancook
05-30-2012, 02:40 AM
Susan,
Just an FYI. You only have 5 lumbar vertebrae. There is no L6, unless you are talking about S1. The sacrum is a fused mass of vertebrae and they use the term S1 for the top portion as far as I know. I hope you can get this worked out. It is frustrating when you don't know which option to take. But be glad you have options. I don't have any surgical options right now. I have to go with injections of different sorts. I would take Jess's advice and speak to Dr. Anand if that is possible for you. I believe, since he's worked with minimally invasive procedures and scoliosis for a long time, he'll give you the straight scoop on what "can" be done from his perspective. Then go back and discuss with Dr. Hart the options and see what his opinion is and if he thinks it will work. I wish you all the best.

Thanks Linda and Rohrer, my specialty is OB GYN. I was actually referring to L4, I talked w/ the Dr.'s PA today. The nerve from L4 is the one whose compression causes ant thigh pain. Thanks for keeping me straight!....hahahahaha.....that was a joke and I didn't even mean it! Susan

loves to skate
06-02-2012, 08:03 PM
Susan, My Doctor told me that minimally invasive surgery would not have worked for me. I think a lot depends on how trapped the nerves are and mine were very trapped.
Sally

jrnyc
06-02-2012, 11:10 PM
i think it is also partly how much
experience a surgeon has with the approach...
Dr Anand swore by it for all kinds of scoli...
the two patients i spoke to who had surgery with him
were pleased with the relief of nerve related pain they got...
both were women over age 58, both with total MI approach...
Dr Lonner offered me "partial" minimally invasive back and
side approaches and i have a great deal of nerve related
stuff going on, especially in lower spine...
i would at least seek one consult with a surgeon who
has done quite a few minimally invasive surgeries for lumbar scoli...
the more experience a surgeon has with an approach, the
better familiar he/she would be with who benefits from
what...
i do remember when MI for knees first started...and the
surgeons who didn't trust it in the beginning...
i personally had MI for ankle surgery...
someday i think lots of current surgeries will be MI approached...
i realize spinal surgery involves a lot more than an ankle....but i also
know i trust Dr Lonner and his opinions for good reason....

jess...& Sparky

susancook
07-25-2012, 03:34 AM
Funny thing when I went back to the Pain Management MD. He had me do the movement maneuvers, "tell me where your pain is..", an exam and now he has me scheduled for L4,5 S1 medial branch block. Go figure! I have the same pain as before, only for some WONDERFUL reason instead of spine pain and R sided burning pain....I just have uncomfortable spine pain. Some days better than others....but it seems reasonable to try all options before THE SURGERY....which I am clearly trying to avoid!
Wish me luck on Friday....no sedation...maybe a silver bullet to chomp on? Who am I kidding? I'm on Medicare, no bullet for me!
Susan

loves to skate
07-25-2012, 12:14 PM
Susan,
I think it is typical not to use sedation for most spine procedures, but I am sure they will use Novocaine on the area before they put the needle in. I will pray that this procedure will work for you.

Sally

jrnyc
07-25-2012, 12:46 PM
never seen sedation used, as you said Sally....
doesn't matter the medical insurance....
doctors do not feel it is needed...
novocaine numbs the area....
most i ever felt was temporary stick from needles, and some pressure...
not intolerable pain....
IF an area is stenosed, then the pain seems to get worse, as the area i was
having injected was very narrow....but that was it...

jess

susancook
07-27-2012, 03:07 AM
Thanks Jess and Sally. I am in such pain right now, that any relief would be welcomed. I didn't use my ice packs nor Lidocaine patches today and did LOTS of walking and I am paying for it.
I was just kidding about the silver bullet, but some sites said that they offer some sedation. Dr. S said that I would not have sedation, but yes, we do use lidocaine in Oregon.
Susan

jrnyc
07-27-2012, 12:42 PM
i had my first epidural in Columbia Pres Hospital in Manhattan...
they opened an IV line "just in case anything happened" but did NOT use any
sedation....that epidural caused no pain, just feeling of pressure on my back...
i have had epidural injections since then (in doctor offices), and they hurt a lot
more on my left side, which has narrowed in many areas of spine......felt
like doc was going into my kidneys, even though he said he was no where near
my kidneys....
still....i was never offered sedation of any kind...at any facility, including hospital...
point is, doctors seemed to feel it isn't needed...
of course, they are never the one layng on the table!!!

good luck whenever you have it done...
in my case, it seemed like a very minor procedure, but that is
my own perspective on it...

jess...& Sparky

susancook
08-01-2012, 01:32 AM
I had a left medial branch block on Friday. I arrived at OHSU with severe pain. I was in such pain before the block that I curled up in a ball on the guerney and my doctor came by and asked me if I was in drug withdrawal! I told him that I was in just such severe pain. I was skeptical that that the procedure would help. Totally amazed! I was almost pain free within a minute of the procedure! The relief, much like Cinderella's brief night at the ball, it lasted but a few hours. It is only supposed to last that long....but that few hours were totally awesome. Now I need to have one more test, then maybe the denervation. I am finally hopeful!
Susan

loves to skate
08-01-2012, 09:51 AM
Susan,
So glad it has worked for you if only for a short period of time. At least it gives you some hope. I wish you the best. Keep us posted.
Sally

rohrer01
08-01-2012, 02:15 PM
Actually, some people have 7 lumbar vertebrae.

I just saw this. It's not the "norm". Five lumbar is normal anatomy. Some people also have six normal digits on each hand and foot, too. =)

rohrer01
08-01-2012, 02:16 PM
I had a left medial branch block on Friday. I arrived at OHSU with severe pain. I was in such pain before the block that I curled up in a ball on the guerney and my doctor came by and asked me if I was in drug withdrawal! I told him that I was in just such severe pain. I was skeptical that that the procedure would help. Totally amazed! I was almost pain free within a minute of the procedure! The relief, much like Cinderella's brief night at the ball, it lasted but a few hours. It is only supposed to last that long....but that few hours were totally awesome. Now I need to have one more test, then maybe the denervation. I am finally hopeful!
Susan

I'm glad to here that your test went well and you got some relief, albeit temporary.

susancook
08-01-2012, 03:32 PM
I'm glad to here that your test went well and you got some relief, albeit temporary.

Amazing how much arthritis of the spine can hurt. I plan to go to Fiji to volunteer for 2 months and due to my doctor's schedule, now I am unsure if I can get everything done in time before I go. Nothing else seemed to work.
Thanks to all that are supportive! Great not to be alone in this journey.
Susan

susancook
08-09-2012, 03:04 AM
Now have bilateral MBB scheduled for tomorrow am. R side now as painful as the L was. Hope that I get the same relief, then the R needs to be done again...then if there is relief a denervation procedure.

Anyone had the denervation procedure? Read about it on the internet, but would appreciate a personal perspective.
Thanks
Susan

susancook
08-09-2012, 10:14 PM
Bilateral medial branch block....ahhhhh.....I had 6 hours of pain relief. I had forgotten how awesome that felt.
Bilateral sciatic pain has returned.....where's the heating pad?
Susan

susancook
08-17-2012, 04:00 PM
Had the lumbar medial branch block-right done for the second time yesterday and again had awesome pain relief...however brief for hours after the procedure.
Now waiting to schedule the neurotomy.
It amazes me how I have such awesome relief of the back pain that I have suffered with for 1.5 years relieved by a 5 minute procedure. I had assumed, based on my recent pain managment MDs opinion that my pain was from my scoliosis. He put off doing the LMBB for months....I could have been so much ore active quite a while ago if I had the procedure done when I first saw him.
Dr. Chen showed me my vertebrae under the floroscopy and she said that I had severe arthritis of the lumbar spine and that she wasn't surprised that I had a lot of back pain. While the procedure was quite painful when the injected the dye and the probes, I have learned to just tolerate most anything on the way to a procedure that might give relief.
Dr. Chen said that I was one of her most cooperative patients...anything to find out what is wrong with my back, so that I can improve the quality of my life and get on with being more active.
I wondered how I would get through 2.5 months in Fiji with my back pain, but decided that like I do with my back pain, to just buck up and tolerate it. I have learned to just keep going no matter how much pain I have. The choice is to lay on the couch with an ice pack or grit my teeth and keep going until I absolutely need to lay down.
My hopes are with the denervation/neurotomy now.
Has anyone had the procedure and how did it go? Thanks!
Susan

titaniumed
08-18-2012, 12:28 PM
Hi Susan

I just found out that my neighbor had a neurotomy done last January, and had a positive report. She isnít a scoli, she went through a phase of car crashes, and well, she is paying more attention now behind the wheel.

Its good that you are posting about this subject...

Fiji involves drinking Kava....I donít know how you can avoid it out there, its part of the program. Make sure you clap after you slam it. He he

I have been to Kava bars in Hawaii....tastes like dirty gym socks, but works well for relaxation.

I struggled with major pain on a few Hawaiian trips years ago.... I thought I was going to die there, it was pretty bad. The plane rides years ago would finish me off.

Ed

susancook
08-20-2012, 12:48 AM
Thanks for the good news about neurotomy. It's for arthritis of the back, so it goes with aging. My scoliosis is just a bonus, I guess.
I FINALLY have my neurotomy/denervation scheduled for mid September w/ Dr. Chen at OHSU!
I've been to Fiji twice before and I find kavakava gross.

Us older folks should consider arthritis of the spine as a possible cause of the back pain and not assume that all of the pain is from the scoliosis. My pain management MD said for the past 6 months that my back pain was from the scoliosis. When I FINALLY talked him into the medial branch block test and received such awesome, but temporary pain relief, that I am glad that I did not jump into the BIG scoliosis surgery last spring when I was in overwhelming pain. The PT helped some...but I felt that the spine fusion was definitely in my future, just didn't know when. Now, it may not be the answer afterall. Time will tell how my curve progresses and the pain changes.

Susan
Susan

susancook
08-26-2012, 03:32 AM
I asked Dr. Chen what she would recommend for my pain in my thoracic area where my kyphosis is and she recommended a thoracic MBB which I had done on Friday. It was super painful and she injected 3 vertebrae bilaterally, I think T8, 9, and 10. I hope to have the denervation for my lumbar area as well as the thoracic are done at the same time. She was skeptical about doing both on the same day, but I told her that after natural childbirth of an 8# baby that I could do anything. I wish that I had found Dr. Chen a year ago!

The Fellow that was helping was sort of interesting....he couldn't figure out why he couldn't get all of the vertebrae to focus in one plane. Since the procedure is for arthritis, I guess that he never considered that I could have BOTH arthritis and scoliosis. Dr Chen said more than once, "she has scoliosis too". It was almost funny and I might have laughed more except they were shoving needles into my facet joints.

So, I'll ask again, has anyone had a denervation done and how much pain did they have afterwards? I've looked on the Internet but can't get a good feel for how much pain you have after the procedure.

Thanks
Susan

susancook
09-07-2012, 03:43 AM
Well, I had my bilateral lumbar denervation today. The procedure was quite painful. I did have an IV with something in it....but I really don't think that it did anything for my back pain during the procedure. Yes, it did help my migraine that I had at the time! The MD gave me #30 Oxycodone which so far, I haven't taken. I sure hope that this helps my back pain. I hope to have a thoracic denervation next week. Dr. Chen said that she would do both procedures today, but they couldn't find anyone in Medicare to approve having both procedures, so I go back next week. What a waste of tax payor money to have 2 separate procedures on 2 different days. Whatever....Looking forward to less back pain. Susan

rohrer01
09-07-2012, 11:02 AM
Susan,
I hope you get some relief with this procedure. What exacty did they do to you? I'm just curious because my doc said that much of my lower back pain could be related to the facet joints. My pain is so low that it is in the sacrum. I had a very annoying burning sensation on the top of my left thigh the other day. I'm a big chicken and don't want to have to go through painful procedures to "find out" if a certain procedure will work. Please let us know how this goes for you. BTW I have NO scoliosis in my lumbar region. It would all be due to degeneration I'm guessing because of the lack of flexibility in the T-spine for so many years.

jrnyc
09-07-2012, 12:08 PM
hey rohr
maybe a facet block might help you....?
sending you PM

jess

susancook
09-07-2012, 10:53 PM
Susan,
I hope you get some relief with this procedure. What exacty did they do to you? I'm just curious because my doc said that much of my lower back pain could be related to the facet joints. My pain is so low that it is in the sacrum. I had a very annoying burning sensation on the top of my left thigh the other day. I'm a big chicken and don't want to have to go through painful procedures to "find out" if a certain procedure will work. Please let us know how this goes for you. BTW I have NO scoliosis in my lumbar region. It would all be due to degeneration I'm guessing because of the lack of flexibility in the T-spine for so many years.

yes, degeneration is a key word! It may be different for different health plans, but for Medicare you need to have two "medial branch blocks" with Lidocaine to see if the neurotomy or denervation might work. If you get at least 80% pain relief for a few hours on both blocks, then you are eligible for the denervation. I had 100% pain relief and was amazed! As I said before, I was curled up in a ball waiting for the procedure the first time, my pain was a "9" and I could barely talk I hurt so much. At the denervation, they cauterize the medial nerve Unfortunately, the nerve regenerates in 12-18 months, but the procedure can be done again. It is a treatment for arthritis of the vertebrae and has nothing to do with scoliosis. I had mine done bilaterally on 2 lumbar vertebrae and for the thoracic, I am having it done bilaterally on 3 vertebrae.

The "test" for lumbar pain related to arthritis is to twist your spine to each side [R and L] and bend backwards. That movement apparently puts tork on the vertebre and causes them to rub together. If that gives you a lot of pain, it is suggestive that your pain may be arthritic pain and you may be a candidate. If you want more gory details or a needle-by-needle gross account of what they did, send me a PM with your phone number and I will gladly call you.

Hoping that both you and I find pain relief! Susan

rohrer01
09-09-2012, 12:58 AM
Thanks, but not looking for gore. I get enough of that with my own injections. I'm just more curious than anything because of the lower back pain that I have. Did it leave you with numbness?

susancook
09-09-2012, 02:40 AM
Thanks, but not looking for gore. I get enough of that with my own injections. I'm just more curious than anything because of the lower back pain that I have. Did it leave you with numbness?

No numbness. Right now I am 2 days post procedure and have a lot of lower back pain from the procedure which is initially expected. The MD gave me Oxycodone, take one..No relief, so I took 2. Maybe a little bit of relief and suprisingly no sedation. It was REALLY tough getting out of bed this morning and it was difficult to walk because of the pain. I assume that the pain is normal and again will improve with time. Already I have noticed that while I do have pain from the procedure, it is a different pain than I had pre-procedure, so maybe that's good. I will tell you how the pain changes over time. I am having 3 procedures in a week while NOTHING was offered for 7 months. Like my brother said, "When are you going to let go of that anger?" ...how do you let go? Haven't figured that out!

Hope that this is helpful and that you find relief. Initially Dr. Chen was going to do BOTH denervations at once, but said that she was worried that she would cause me too much pain. I told her, "Bring it on!" She obviously does not have back pain and when I am alone in the evening with an "8" level pain for the entire evening....now that's pain. Procedural pain that lasts an hour, but has a promise of decreasing my evening pain score over time, "priceless". Rohrer, you probably know what I am talking about. In many ways, you finally say, "whatever". Short of the BIG fusion which unfortunately might be in my little old lady future, and procedure that works in awesome. Maybe I am just buying time...no, I am buying quality of life.

Rohrer, I hope that you are having a relatively painfree evning! Susan

rohrer01
09-09-2012, 11:10 PM
Thank you, Susan. My pain is being managed. It could be better. By that I mean I want off of the drugs. I have to come to terms with the fact that it probably isn't ever going to happen. Anger? What anger!!!!!!???? Yep. I know what you mean. I think it's more a feeling of helplessness for me. Only so much can be done and I expect perfection. Perfection just isn't possible in medicine. You can only get so much help.

I'm sorry you are in so much pain from the procedure. I'm more sore after my shots, but nothing like you describe. I go in for round two of Botox tomorrow. If it doesn't work better this time, I think I'll just give up on that treatment and stick to the trigger point injections. I hope you are feeling better.

susancook
09-11-2012, 11:10 PM
Hi Susan

I just wanted to say welcome...

I went as long as I could and had pretty bad lumbar DDD and 4 herniations with sciatica. This can also lead to end plate damage....a good question for Dr Hart.

I did not do any shots. It was offered....but at the end with my x-rays looking pretty bad it just didnít make sense to me. I was barely walking and pain was spiking 10. Death and taxes, and my tax was due. I was a Luque wire candidate in 1976 so it was a long wait.

I did just about everything else, Chiro, massage, and hot water soaks. Hot water is the easiest way to get the most relief from extreme pain events.

I do have a stretching machine......and an arch table. Electrostim machine, sock installer, walker, ski poles, and scuba gear! All used for scoliosis.....Just PM me if you are interested. The stretching machine is a professional unit that was ordered by a doctor for me, and its heavy duty and weighs a few hundred pounds...not an easy thing to move, but can be done. Anything is possible, Iíve proven that.

Ed

Ed: What's "end plate damage"....don't think that I want that! Susan

susancook
09-11-2012, 11:21 PM
6 days post denervation/radiofrequency neurotomy bil lumbar and I have only a little bit of lower back pain. It's pretty amazing! I need to get over the anger that I feel for the first pain MD that I saw who said that he thought about doing the procedure in January, but decided not to. All that wasted time and poor quality of life. Evening on the couch with an ice bag. Bummed. Maybe I should put pins in a Voodoo doll. I need to get over this. Susan

susancook
10-01-2012, 07:59 AM
Just to complete my saga, I had bilateral thoracic denervation on 3 vertebrae done early in the morning on the day that I left for FIJI for 2 months! Not ideal, but the original ordering MD forgot to put in the order and that was the only time possible. They said that they gave me "conscious sedation", but the pain of the procedure was a "10". YIKES!!!! So far, I have some pain relief, but not as much as I had hoped. Thank God that I have ice bags at the resort where we are staying. Susan

loves to skate
10-01-2012, 08:45 PM
Susan,
Sorry to hear you didn't get the pain relief you were hoping for, but at least you got some. I guess we take what we can get. A 10 is horrible. I hope they don't charge you for the conscious sedation. I am getting a little relief from my SI joint injection.
Enjoy your time in Fuji.
Sally

susancook
10-04-2012, 07:08 AM
Susan,
Sorry to hear you didn't get the pain relief you were hoping for, but at least you got some. I guess we take what we can get. A 10 is horrible. I hope they don't charge you for the conscious sedation. I am getting a little relief from my SI joint injection.
Enjoy your time in Fuji.
Sally

Thanks Sally. Actually w/ time, it seems that my pain relief is getting better. Guess that I am impatient! If I ever have another neurotomy, we will have some serious discussions about conscious sedation. During the procedure they have to ask about the burning of the nerves and if I am feeling it in other areas, radiating areas from my back. Somehow, there needs to be a better way of sedating me w/ analgesic relief than they provided. I tried to do relaxation breathing, but I was in such pain that all I could do is to try to survive.

I am trying everything to avoid surgery.

I am so happy that you are getting some relief from your SI joint injection! I hope that it continues, maybe it will with a little more time.

I am enjoying working in Fiji! HUGS, Susan

susancook
12-19-2012, 02:40 PM
Just a followup. I had a thoracic and lumbar denervation or radiofrequency ablation done 3 months ago and still have fantastic relief! So, if you are an older person and suspect that some of your back pain might be due to arthritis, I would recommend the procedure. My only regret was that I didn't do it sooner.
Susan

jrnyc
12-19-2012, 05:38 PM
well, unfortunately, it doesn't work for everyone...

jess